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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2010, 08:10 PM
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Default Relay Replacement In RCM


The RCM (Relay Control Module) can be resoldered to cure the poor contacts but the relays themselves can have the contacts burn up as in the reported air pump problems.
When re-soldering the bad connections it is best to de-solder them as much as possible and clean the terminal as much as you can. There is not much point in flooding it with more solder as if it will not adhere to a dirty surface anyway.
Relays are cheap little parts that can ruin the expensive RCM that costs a good buck. I have searched for a relay that can be used to replace the relays in the module. The number 5706 is stamped on all five relays so they are all the same. I had no luck looking for that number but I did find one that looks the same and has the same pin pattern. The relay comes with two pin patterns (footprint), the US and the European footprint, ours is the European footprint. It is a 12 volt auto relay and in bulk they cost less than $1 each.


American Zettler part# AZ970E-1A-12D
Data Sheet
(click)

Form A relays are SPST (single pole, single throw) with a default state of normally open.


We now need to unsolder the relay, this is trickier than soldering it in place, but how hard can it be. Pizzaguy must do it all the time so he can help us out.
How to de-solder.
Basic De-soldering Guide by dxzone.com

Here is a photo showing my spare RCM and the five relays.
For the record the board has poor solder joints at the well known position.
The board has positions for six relays and in the vacant position you can see the mounting points and contact pin positions.
One of the fuses when removed affected two relays, I never did quite figure it out.

Thanks go to pizzaguy for his help, so if anything is wrong blame him.


Bottom View


The following pictures and text are from Tighed1's post on burnt relays

You don't need magnification to see the problem some are having with the Air Pump relay. Checkout these pics.




Should look like this or even better:

Attached Files
File Type: pdf Relay-AZ970E-1A-12D.pdf (98.0 KB, 40 views)

Last edited by onehundred80; 02-04-2014 at 01:38 PM. Reason: Data Sheet added
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Old 12-14-2010, 10:33 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In Rcm


That LOOKS like the right one. The specs in the link look right and I believe our relays are "Form A" which are SPST (single pole, single throw - that means their contacts "make" only when power is applied to the coil, when power is removed, the contacts relax but there is no "normally open" contact that then is connected to the "common" pin. This makes since, since our relays are used to turn on the fuel pump, starter, etc. They are not used to switch between one thing with power applied to the relay coil and another with power not applied to the relay coil).

I have looked and looked, looks like all relays in the diagrams ARE SPST "Form A" type. The ELECTRICAL specs are fine, I just wonder about the pinout - are these pins in the exact same position as ours? Hard to tell from photos, but I bet they are. I think this is a winner, 100/80. How much are they in lots of one or two? I'd spend a few dollars to get one in my hands - if they are 'the one', it'd pay for someone among us to have a few! (Thinking of a guy in Arizona we all know, but then, if they are a few dollars, I'll keep some around here.)

You can unsolder these using a clean iron and "Solder Wick", just so you are careful. I find that flowing a lot of EXTRA solder on first makes the wick work better. But I prefer to use my desoldering vacuum.



I hate to think of just how many modules that are replaced just because one relay gets sluggish or it's contacts get pitted. Relays ARE notoriously unreliable.


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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 12-15-2010, 12:11 AM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In Rcm


[quote=pizzaguy]That LOOKS like the right one......
I have looked and looked, looks like all relays in the diagrams ARE SPST "Form A" type. The ELECTRICAL specs are fine, I just wonder about the pinout - are these pins in the exact same position as ours? Hard to tell from photos, but I bet they are. I think this is a winner..[quote]
I measured the pin pattern with a vernier and it looks just fine. Price wise they can't cost too much, I'll go to a store I know that has all kinds of stuff like this.
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Old 12-15-2010, 06:57 AM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In Rcm


I like the direction you guys went on this.
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Old 12-15-2010, 10:36 AM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In Rcm


ALWAYS THINKING AHEAD, please keep everyone posted.


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Old 12-15-2010, 10:51 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In Rcm


I was reading through the shop manual to try to find a part number or rating on the relays and it repeatedly said if one relay goes bad you must replace the whole RCM. LOL!!! You are doing a good thing by sourcing these things, because that is a $30 fix if you need to go out and buy a soldering iron! I'd love to see more threads like this that go more in depth on the elctronic systems of the car. Megasquirt is one of the coolest things in the world to me because all the information is available for you to digest (www.megamanual.com - SERIOUSLY CHECK IT OUT!).


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Old 12-15-2010, 11:17 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In Rcm


Mark, I think what you meant is that there is no "normal closed" position on that relay. That is a "normal open" relay since it needs power to "close". Correct me if I'm wrong...

James



Last edited by James1549; 12-15-2010 at 11:24 PM.
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Old 12-16-2010, 12:20 AM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In Rcm


Quote:
Originally Posted by James1549
Mark, I think what you meant is that there is no "normal closed" position on that relay. That is a "normal open" relay since it needs power to "close". Correct me if I'm wrong...

James
He said no "normally open" contact, meaning it is normally open but there is no contact in that position, unlike the power seat relay for instance.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 07-21-2011, 11:35 AM
 
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


I Have Read All The Treads On Rcm Fix, I Tried Them And Still No Help. I Also Changed The Batteries In The Key Fob, Now The Car Cranks More Often But Cuts Off In 4 Seconds. I Can Get The Car To Crank With The Key I Haven't Changed The Battery In And It Will Run Longer And Then Cut Off. What Am I Doing Wrong? Is This Rcm Covered Under The 8/80 Warranty? Please Help, I Want To Drive This Baby.
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Old 07-21-2011, 11:42 AM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


Quote:
Originally Posted by SILVERBULLET
I Have Read All The Treads On Rcm Fix, I Tried Them And Still No Help. I Also Changed The Batteries In The Key Fob, Now The Car Cranks More Often But Cuts Off In 4 Seconds. I Can Get The Car To Crank With The Key I Haven't Changed The Battery In And It Will Run Longer And Then Cut Off. What Am I Doing Wrong? Is This Rcm Covered Under The 8/80 Warranty? Please Help, I Want To Drive This Baby.
Have you tried to reprogram the key fob? It sounds like you have a problem in the security system that's not reading the security code. If the car starts and stalls out a few seconds after it's most likely the security system.


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Last edited by robby363; 07-21-2011 at 11:59 AM.
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Old 07-21-2011, 12:31 PM
 
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


No I Haven't Tried That. I'll See If There Is A Tread On That And Try It, Thanks
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Old 07-21-2011, 12:46 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


Quote:
Originally Posted by SILVERBULLET
No I Haven't Tried That. I'll See If There Is A Tread On That And Try It, Thanks
This tell you how.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Key fob.JPG (122.0 KB, 121 views)


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Old 07-21-2011, 12:54 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


Quote:
Originally Posted by robby363
Have you tried to reprogram the key fob? It sounds like you have a problem in the security system that's not reading the security code. If the car starts and stalls out a few seconds after it's most likely the security system.
The transponder works without any batteries. The batteries only power the transmitter for the remote opening and locking of the doors.

Have you got any codes set?

Last edited by onehundred80; 07-21-2011 at 01:05 PM.
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Old 07-21-2011, 01:01 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


Quote:
Originally Posted by onehundred80
The transponder works without any batteries. The batteries only power the transmitter for the remote opening and locking of the doors.
I remembered that after I posted it.. my bad. But his problem sounds like it's in the security system if it starts and then shuts off a few seconds after.


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Old 07-21-2011, 02:21 PM
 
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


I Haven't Check For Codes Yet. But I Did Resolder The Bad Joints, Right Where The Pictures Show. Tried To Start Car With Key And There Was Nothing. Tried 5 Or 6 Times And Finally The Starter Clicked Once And Then Cranked The Next Time. It Run About 2 Minutes And Shut Down.after A Few Minutes It Would Crank Again And Run. Then Iput New Batteries In The Key Fob And Tried That And It Cranked More Often But Would Shut Down In A Few Seconds.
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Old 07-21-2011, 02:54 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


Quote:
Originally Posted by SILVERBULLET
I Haven't Check For Codes Yet. But I Did Resolder The Bad Joints, Right Where The Pictures Show. Tried To Start Car With Key And There Was Nothing. Tried 5 Or 6 Times And Finally The Starter Clicked Once And Then Cranked The Next Time. It Run About 2 Minutes And Shut Down.after A Few Minutes It Would Crank Again And Run. Then Iput New Batteries In The Key Fob And Tried That And It Cranked More Often But Would Shut Down In A Few Seconds.
What was the problem you were having before you soldered it. The more I think about it could be the fuel pump relay and not the security system like I first thought.


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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 07-22-2011, 12:44 PM
 
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


To Start With, You Turn Switch And Nothing Happens,all The Dash Lights Are On And Horn Blows . So I Replace The Battery. This Didn't Help At All. Then I Checked Out The Rcm And Resoldered The Bad Joints And This Didn't Help Any. I Then Change The Batteries In The Key Fob And It Would Crank More Often But Would Shut Down In 2 Seconds. Inow Have Reprogramed Thefob And It Didn't Crank The First Couple Of Times And Then It Sarted Cranking And Ran Around 12 Minutes And Then Shut Down, I Did This A Few Times, But It Now Almost Cranks Everytime Time You Try.
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Old 07-22-2011, 01:30 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


CPS.......crankshaft positon sensor. Mine would start, but run rough then die. Does it do this when it runs or is it smooth as normal? Rough, I'd say CPS..


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Old 07-22-2011, 09:53 PM
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


Once again 180 thanks again for the good info and Pictures.


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Old 07-22-2011, 11:14 PM
 
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Default Re: Relay Replacement In RCM


It Runs Smooth. Also When It Cranks It Hardly Even Turns Over Before It Starts
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Old 07-22-2011, 11:14 PM
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