Let's talk power!
 

During the last few weeks while getting my car to look right, I have started looking into ways to increase the power. I had fun reading all that I could find on the subject here on the forum and all over the net. Got a kick out of all the threads about dropping a Hemi in one. In my searching I believe I have found the most reasonably priced super charger kit for a Crossfire which I posted about.

My goal is to not spend more than $3,000 - $4,0000 which based on what I paid for my car and staying under the SRT6 in cost. Before I mention what I think my options are I would like to invite the nay sayers to please leave and find another thread to piss on.

I also want you guys to know that I am not new at this sort of thing. I look at everything from an investment stand point. I have owned and built many unique cars and have always made money on them. It is only the daily transportation cars that I left stock that cost me money. A key is to have something really nice that the market isn't flooded with. for example If you look at my gallery you will see a Cobra replica I built from a bare frame over three years. While the whole world was building the 427 Cobra, I built a museum quality replica of the standard 289 "slab side" Street Cobra. Carroll Shelby was quoted as saying it was the finest replica he had seen, signed it (see pictures). I then sold the car for $52,000 while my total investment was $28,000. If you wanted a really nice 289 slab side Cobra, I had the only one in north America for sale.

If I am to stay in my budget I have to do all the work myself and have the following options which are either forced induction or a V8.

Forced induction options are:

1. The German kit I posted about on this forum, but still a little too costly

2. build my own supercharger kit or turbo kit. I can do this in the budget and have no problem with the fabrication work but would need help with controlling the A/F ratio.

3. SRT6 engine swap would be pretty easy. I would probably surprise the crap out of SRT owners in stop light battles.

V8 options:

To stay in the budget I don't see how you can do this without keeping it simple by using a Mercedes engine. Sorry, the Hemi is out of the question.

Mercedes V8 options are 1998 -2006 V8's such as:

4.3 Litre engines can be had really cheap but may not give enough bang
C43 AMG engine, this is a nice engine and I would use it if I found one at the right price.
5.0 can be found and will fit the budget with a little over 300HP and gobs of torque
5.5L, 55 engine this would be nice but hard to stay in budget.

All of these V8's look just like our V6 except with two more cylinders. These engines weigh only 130 pounds more than our 3.2L V6 and will fit right into our cars.

BTW the Startech 6.1 Crossfire is a bored and stroked 5.0 and they sell their car for $170,000. I am thinking if I go the V8 route I should be able to someday undercut Startech and recoup my investment.

The V8 will fit and is an easy (form my past experience) swap.

Each of these V8's have some performance options, are smooth as silk, durable and would sound nice.

If you doubt my ability to stay in the budget, please see my "cost effective mods" post where I put on brand new wheels, 90% new Michelin Pilot Sport 2's and lowered the car all for under $700.

Has anyone else thought about this and come to similar conclusions?

Re: Let's talk power!
 

Why not go the v-8 route, it will be a blast and it probably will cost as much as the Supercharger kit from Germany or Renntech, and you will be able to make more power with a turbo at a later time.
I think with a ecu tune on the MBZ 5.0 they can put out well over 350 hp and who knows how much insane torque it will produce.

Either way you need to get a good stand alone ecu probably cost $2,500. then the motor most likely from a wrecked mbz, used is $4,500. get it tuned and running and I'm sure you'll be a grinning fool. If you still got some cash to burn, bolt up those turbos and start breaking parts! :)

Otherwise the smartest route is to buy an srt6 and forget about all this dreaming.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

No offense to the SRT guys, but other than the motor I prefer the regular Crossfire. If they would have just put only the supercharged engine in the regular Crossfire I would have liked it a lot better.

I was just reading some information about swapping a 430 engine into a CLK320 and it sounded pretty straight forward. They used the ECU from the 430. The CLK and SLK/Crossfire share the same basic engine bay. Any special parts if needed like exhaust manifolds could come from the C43. Mercedes started putting V8's into the C class chassis in 1998 with the C43 AMG.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

Having owned both a 2006 Limited and now a SRT-6 It will be interesting (and fun) to see how things work for you.

I too, am budget minded but only so-so with the wrenches, and not nearly the time (to many expensive hobbies).

I agree that a V8 engine swap would be the easiest way to gain performance.

Simple questions I would like to ask (not pissing on your thread)

1) Will you need a new ECU and if so, would it be compatible with the wiring harness, sensors etc..?

2) I assume you have a 6 speed manual transmission and it will mate to the V8?

3) Will Limited suspension be able to handle the extra weight and speed?

4) Will the differential handle the extra torque?

5) What other mods do you think will be needed to accommodate the exhaust manifolds (or headers) if any. Will you need to modify the frame etc..

6) Do you have a good digital camera for pictures?

Re: Let's talk power!
 

No, not yet still having to use the one on my cell until my digital get back from Olympus.

Rentech, AMG and Startech know all the answers to the questions around a V8 Swap and none of them are talking. they would rather sell the conversion for astronomical prices. I have done what appears to be much more complicated swaps in the past. Next time any of you are at a car show look at the brand new Corvette engines and computer controlled transmission in the '30's street rods. It isn't hard to make this work as long as you have the original harness and ECU's to go with the engine.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

I like the V8 swap idea.

The trick is to find a wrecked low-miles CLK/C-class donor car to provide mechanical and electronic parts. I know M-Benz tries to be as opaque and mysterious as possible regards ECU programming so the mechanical swap portion may prove to be the easy part !

Slim

Re: Let's talk power!
 

I am in Dallas where C class Mercedes are just as plentiful as F150's. I am very intrigued with the idea of the V8 especially after I found out the weight difference is very small. I wouldn't attempt this without having the entire engine harness and ECU. I did come across a bunch of C43 guys that swap out their engine for the C55 engine and have found they don't need to change the ECU. Just an easy swap.

I also discovered our automatic transmission is basically the same as the ones behind the V8's which may explain why SRT6's only came as automatics. There is only a small difference in the part number after the decimal point. Often this may mean only a minor difference such as the length of the tail shaft. I will keep checking this out but it looks like the stock auto trans can handle the torque.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

Having a bigger (mercedes) V8 in the Crossfire would be fun that's for sure, but I just wonder if the performance gain over the SRT6 (if any) would be worth all the trouble? There's no doubt, you can't beat the sound of a healthy V8 thru the right mufflers though.
For what ever it's worth, the shop that built my hood is chomping at the bit to do a Crossfire/HEMI swap. After seeing some of the other "projects" that they have in their shop, I wouldn't hesitate to let them build one for me. (if I could only afford one that is). :D

Re: Let's talk power!
 

Did you look in to the C32? That motor has 350 hp...it's a v6. It came in the 2000-2002 C class.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

not a bad idea, but looking at the budget, will it fit in there?

Re: Let's talk power!
 

I've seen complete SRT engines/autos on ebay for $2,000+/-.

At that price, your bang per buck performance is hard to beat. While the engine is out, put a renntech kit on it and go to town.

Let me know what you do just in case I run into you again in/around Dallas area. :cool:

SQ

Re: Let's talk power!
 

First of all the easiest part of the whole project is doing the engine swap, the hardest part is not finding the part,s but getting all the computers to jive. The bosch ecus are not tuner friendly unless your working on a vw or audi. Maybe Startech can help you out with re programming the ecu, but I don't think that's the business they are into. Good luck on your mission, that is if you choose to accept it! :D

Hemi Surprise ?
 

I have to admit, nothing is as impressive as a HEMI.

Would be very cool to pop open a Crossfire's hood and hear folks say...

"Wow, that thing's got a HEMI !" :cool:

Slim

Re: Hemi Surprise ?
 

I just don't see the wow factor behind a Hemi in a crossfire. It would be more impressive to have the 4.3 or 5.0 mercedes v8.

I don't know the specs of the Hemi exactly, but does it have twin spark plugs, overhead cams, a variable intake manifold, and how do the weights compare between a big 6.0 liter Hemi and the 4.3-5.0 liter MBZ?

Also will the sensors in the Hemi block be compatible with those required to feed information to the Bosch computer?

Obliviously the Hemi will have way more torque than the Benz engine, but in such a light short wheelbase car the TC will be fighting the beast under the hood constantly. Hemi in a crossfire might be cool for a one off project but as an everyday driver I just don't see the point.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

But then all you would have is an SRT-6, without the brakes, suspension, transmission, tuned exhaust, and Alcantara seats equipped with the electric flapper in the back.

I think for what Lantana is seeking, the V8 will be the best route. The other issues can be solved later with performance A/M upgrades.
(StopTech, headers, dual exhaust etc) Could even wield the flapper shut, yank the fuse and get a A/M spoiler.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

The C32 is the SRT6 engine. 10 HP difference in their HP ratings. No one has ever explained where the 10 missing horses are. If they even are missing...

Re: Hemi Surprise ?
 

If you are talking about a 426 Hemi I would agree, but that engine would never fit and is way to heavy. The new small block Hemi is fine and you can them pretty cheap but the cost, time and effort of all the fabrication would put wouldn't be worth it. I know are cars say Chrysler on them but they are not Chryslers. It would be just as easy to put a Ford or Chevy motor in it as a Chrysler product. If these cars had come with the new Hemi's they probably would have sold better. Mechanically these cars are Mercedes so staying with a Mercedes engine makes everything a little easier. I would love to see someone do the Hemi, it just won't be me.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

So far the v8 sounds like your best bet... surprisingly though the 43s are not all that cheap even though they are very old.. they are good engines though and if you can fit one with a custom turbo you will be pushing quiet some power... and turbocharging the 43s has been done in the past...

It would be pointless to put a c32 engine in there.. as the srt-6 engine is the same thing and costs less used... and if this is the route than just buy an srt-6 it will be cheaper and less consuming

And I have yet to be proven that the srt-6 engine pushes less than the 32s as all dynos have yet seen on either of these cars are just about the same and if there is a difference it is because of dyno set up and conditions the car was dynoed in..

Wish I could give some actually useful input, but I do not feel qualified enough to do so... your best bet is to post a similar topic on mbworld.org or benzworld they have more qualified people to answer your questions as many of them have much more experience with these engines than us crossfire owners do and there are many more engine modders out there than here...

But I would love to see your steps and process so keep us posted on what is going on as this is very interesting.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

This is definitely an option that I listed above and am looking at. this would be the easiest to do. I haven't seen a $2,000 dollar SRT6engine yet but have seen them just under $3,000.

While some may think "just buy an SRT", this isn't for me. I don't care for the interior, the rougher ride, or the wing. I do like their front bumper. Also I like to modify my cars and the SRT6 is a future classic and should be left stock IMO.

Re: Let's talk power!
 

Actually I have not ruled out the SRT-6 engine as I would prefer an SRT-6 without the brakes (I design and make better ones), suspension that loosens my fillings, transmission? (I have that), tuned exhaust (I can do better), Alcantara seats? (don't like the suede and all black interior). I would have preferred for them to just drop the good motor into the limited.

All being equal though, I like the V8. Kind of a Startech clone for a tiny fraction of the cost.