UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

There's been much discussion over the past year regarding the pro's and con's of having a Crossfire club in the UK. Having followed posts and hearing views, I thought it was time to put forward a proposal so we can all move forward together with with a common aim.

Due to the low numbers of our clan, a formal club with all the required formalities is not neccesary. Therefor we should remain as an informal group with no appointed leaders, no membership fees etc. If the group was to grow, Im sure this could change.

XFi. The Club, as you will have read, has been reformed and has been legally registered in the USA. Apart from the benefits of being part of the collective voice for the Xfire, it may be important to consider that this forum may not exist for the long term. It continues due to the kindness of its owner at no charge. Without it we would be out of business. XFi are very conciouse of this and will be taking an active role in preserving this forum for the long term, and thats a cause worth supporting. The posts indicate that most people would like to have some association with XFi, and I believe the best way to do this is to a become a member of XFi, but its an individuals choice.
I understand XFi will be open for memberships in 2/3 weeks time, I expect fees and payment method to be conf' by XFi in dur course. Please note, access to the forum is not dependant on being a member of XFi. I just believe its worthwhile.

There is also interest in operating under a group name. Given the above, I would propose the name XFi UK. This would demonstrate our affiliation with XFi, which would be supported through hopefully some of us choosing to be paid up members. Affiliation means that we would share the same values, goals and ethos as XFi, who are also supportive of this.

There are about 12 drivers attending the meets, and if the majority of these indicate their views and agreement/diss agreement we can take it as a vote and move forward together.

The above represents only my views, if anyone would like to offer an alternative proposal, the floor is open!
Cheers Steve - UK

Proposal Withdrawn 23.30HRS 28/09/2008 Due to low voting response. Unable to reach a majority & no other proposals put forward

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Steve...A question, I agree in principle with your Proposal...

My personal concern is that those choosing to become members of XFi International and pay their fee's will in the eventuality of the current CrossfireForum.org closing, will continue to have use of the newly formed Xfi International forum.

What about those here in the UK that choose to stay as we are and not pay a fee to become members of XFI International..will we still has access to the newly formed Xfi International Forum..or will we have to join and pay a fee to use it?

My thoughts of a group name is solely depend on the answer to the above..

Cheers

Ken.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Hi Ken - No one knows what the future holds. The most import thing is to know that XFi will work professionaly towards securing the future of this forum. Therefor, another forum will hopefully never be needed. That means that access to this one should allways be free to anyone, just as it is now.
The fact alone that these efforts are going on is enough to convince me that I should support this club.

ps It would very disturbing to think that we had to join any club to get access to a new forum. If this happened
people would just find another free one. Please feel free to suggest an alternative name should you have one.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Or set one up. It’s not hard to do - there are plenty of places out there where you can do set up a forum.

Some questions - of a Devil’s Advocate flavour:

• XFi seems to be very USA based - this forum is, and clearly the majority of Crossfire owners are there. What benefits are there for us, as a small provincial group of 12 on the other side of the Atlantic for being affiliated to them?

• I’d also like to ask what benefits a UK member of XFi would get? It’s hardly a simple task to shop the cars states side to join in the Dragon meets, for example, is it?

• If someone is not an XFi member, would the meetings we have enjoyed so far be off limits if the UK XFi becomes a reality and such meetings fall under that banner?

The problem here, as others have mentioned, is the small scale of the UK gatherings. There are some scenarios:

1 - We stay as we are, possibly set up a UK Crossfire forum/web site and base operations a round that, with individuals opting to join XFi is they feel the personal inclination. The UK web presence would be a back stop incase this forum goes south.

2 - Meets carry on as they are, with all welcome, but under the XFI UK banner. This could create an “us and them” situation where those who aren’t a paid up member feel “outside” shunned (OK, a strong word - but I hope you get the direction this point is heading).

3 - Meets are only open to XFi members, which could fragment the small numbers we have already.

I’d say that I am open to the XFi UK idea, but I haven’t really heard much which has sold me the idea completely partly due to the small amount of information which has been flowing my way about it. In fact, when I started on the logo idea, I was going on what I had been told - a we’d be operating under a UK banner. The XFi had not even been mentioned in this context.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

The banner, or name is wide open for suggestions. Though various names have been played around with, I just happen to be the first to suggested one and ask for a response to try and move it forward, and Im hoping someone else will do the same, so a choice can be made.

Paul, Thanks for very constructive observations.
Cheers Steve

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Hi All
Can i just ask why we feel the need to tie ourselfs up with rules etc just to say that we are members of XFi or anyother club ,

Are we joining the XFi as a group or as single members ?

I also think that you will need to become a member of Xfi to use the web site ( or no one will pay up ) .
As there are only up to 12 of us in the Uk so far that take the time to meet up , Are we going to exclude one of us from a meeting because they are not a XFI member.

Cheers

Andy

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

hi,
my thoughts so far :

A UK group would allow anyone to attend an event as a"guest"

Reason for a UK group ? Identity and enhanced communication, i.e. people who want to know when the next event is being arranged and want an e-mail telling them about it. Also protection against any US based decisions to alter this forum. And you can't dismiss the value of a badge ;)

Reason to associate with the US group ? The identity thing again and also I have bought two things for my Crossfire, both only available from the states and one offered a discount to members of this forum. I hope that any more formal US group had enhanced buying power and would give me access to bigger discounts.

Form and culture of the group ? Informal !

cheers,

Paul

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Hi All
Can i just ask why we feel the need to tie ourselfs up with rules etc just to say that we are members of XFi or anyother club ,
Andy, We are staying as we are - what rules do you mean?
Are we joining the XFi as a group or as single members ?
We are not joining XFi as a group. Its up to individuals if they wish to join XFi.
I also think that you will need to become a member of Xfi to use the web site ( or no one will pay up ) . What web site do you mean? We will continue to use this forum which is free. If we do have a UK web site in the future, we will deal how to run that when/if it ever happens.
As there are only up to 12 of us in the Uk so far that take the time to meet up , Are we going to exclude one of us from a meeting because they are not a XFI member. See hairdaleks questions above - no, no one will be excluded - membership of XFi is personal choice and has no bearing on what happens over here.
Nothing will change in any respect - we are staying as we are - only difference is:
1: We have the additional opportunity to become individual members of XFi, and thats an individual desicion - if folks dont want to, thats cool. I intend becoming a member, others may not, as its up to them. If its up to individual choice, then it cant be an issue.
2: Everyone has said we ought to operate under an name, so lets have one. I have suggested one, the floor is open.
Thanks for questions Andy
Cheers Steve

Cheers

Andy[/quote]

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

could it be described as a sort of "free registration" in the way that some web sites do and just comes down to an identity, sense of belonging, being involved whenever something is being organised and bascially doing what we do already, no change just... a badge.

Paul

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

I agree, Just doing what we do allready, but under a name/badge. According to the posts and converstaions Ive had over the year, its what people have been very enthusiastic about. The option to be a member of XFi is there for anyone anyway, personal choice can never be an issue.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

To Be or Not to Be...That is the Question?..

And the answer to that has been fully explaned by Steve-UK in some depth, and as mentioned a few times will make no difference to the way we operate here in the UK..

Our group will continue with the same arrangments for meets as before with no imput from XFi International on how to operate and run our UK club.

Current site use, group discounts and entering into thread discussion's with other Xfiire owners around the globe is I feel a big advantage (and fun) to us and continues to be available to all of us, FXi regestered members or not.

At some stage having our own named UK web site would great, but I feel it's not urgently needed at this time.

So its on with the ball! Steve and I spoke about an unusual group meet location ( no, its not a Brewery ) before the Christmas lunch date...details to follow.

Cheers

Ken.

PS ..Its good to know that meet loation for 2009 are being suggest and
investaged already by a couple of our members.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

I'm getting to this thread a bit late, but at least with the benefit of being able to read the views already posted. I support the idea of operating under the XFi UK banner for the positive reasons already stated, and personally I will be paying the membership fee.

Thanks Steve for kicking off the thought process.:cool:

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

It seems like time to vote on a name. My vote goes to" XFi UK"

cheers,

Paul

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

UK Members
As at 23.30hrs 28/09/2008 the voting response posted on this proposal has been poor, with only 3 votes posted in the last 7 days.
Thanks to the following members who have voted;

UK Ken
lissXF
Beeblebrox

This number is not sufficient to confirm a majority, and therefor the proposal is now withdrawn.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

I don’t think that the whole XFi thing has been fully explained. We’ve been told that it will be a good idea for the affiliation, but as we don’t actually know what the XFi will be up to yet, it seems premature to make a firm decision. When the XFi is up and running, we’ll have a better idea how this well or won’t benefit. At the moment, it’s just too vague.

For these reasons, I didn’t vote. Think of it as an abstention rather than a “no”. I’m in the “wait and see” camp.

However, this may not be the best place to make such a discussion. Maybe it’s better tacked face to face, and a vote taken at that point.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Hi Paul.( Hairydalek)

Personally I feel Steve-UK explaned fully what was going on in his proposal after much two way conversation (PM's) with FP about how we would be effected her in the UK, and made it very clear as far as he possably could.

We are all happy to use the current forum and with the amount of content, world wide exposure etc, which we get at no cost to any of us. If we had to depend on a newly formed UK site alone then we would be severely limited in contacting like minded Xfire owners.

I personally intend to pay a small membership subscription fee to FXi and hope to benifit from the rearranged forum rather than take the chance of the current forum folding. But this will not stop my enthusiasm for our UK group. I want the best of both world's, and the XFi forum will continue to attract's more UK members by its coverage and thereby benefiting us all.

I also think this is the correct place to discuss any Xfire matter's that effect our group of UK owners. We certainly never get a full (face to face) turnout at any of our meets.. although one live's in hope.

Lastly, as said earlier, no one has to commit to being part of FXi International or paying a fee, we just carry on as we are with free use of the fourm, being a FXi members or not.

Cheers

Ken.

PS Details to follow soon of very cheap Mobile1 0-40 Synthetic oil all new, sealed and available to all ..I have already purchased and its an up front deal..

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Hi All

So are we saying (as i understand it ) , We carry on as we are meeting up as & when , Some of us will be joining the Xfi when it opens up , There is a list of possible 'club' names for the Uk owners , Which could be in line with the XFi naming (XFi-USA , XFi-Uk etc) & we are thinking that this forum will not stay open in the furture but could be replaced with a pay to use site/forum .


Cheers

Andy

P.s Ken count me in on the oil deal .

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Andy (Zero Zero)...We in the UK will carry on just as we are and always have done..no changes or FXi envolement in how we operate..

The forum will always be free to use whatever changes take place.. XFi are taking over the running of it to ensure it continues as a FOC forum for all to use.

XFi International in the USA will charge a fee to become a member..not known to date what the benefits of this will be.. A few of use will pay a fee to FXi our personal choice..others will not. Paying a fee to assist XFi or not paying a fee, will not effect our group in the UK.

Steve's Proposal was quite clear and out lined the details much clear than I have done..

There is now no action to take as the proposal has been with drawn.

Cheers

Ken.

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Just to restate my understanding, please correct me if I am wrong, please !

1. The US group is happening, it is inevitable
2. The US group ( at this time ) will fund the forum so that it remains free. IMHO This decision could change in the future as they own and fund it.
3. The Uk group does not change in any way shape or form except for "4" and "5" below :
4. A name
5. A badge
6. An "affiliation" with the US main group, which I believe we have already.
7. Some members may if they want to join the US/International group, for those members that do it reinforces the alliances between the two groups.

For those that meet up on the 12th Oct, if we did or didn't decide on a name then we would still meet up, only difference would be a name and a badge.

I have proposed a meeting next July at Cars in the Park in Lichfield. If that happens I don't see anything being any different except that we may have a group name and a badge, or we may not.

Most of the questions seem to be about "what else is this", and I think the simple answer is "nothing".

I have some experience of debating decisions by e-mail , text etc in other groups, and they are incredibly difficult. You just can't believe how much information a human being loses when faced with just text leading to a lack of clarity in communication. Text is the only way we have of communicating as a larger group and I believe that we will get to an understanding, it just takes a long time and patience is often needed.

cheers

Paul

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Sorry, Ken - this sentence makes no sense whatsoever :confused:

As I have seen it, if we take the XFi name in our group name, then this implies some kind of closer tie to the XFi than we currently have. In fact, I believe that it implies that we are an official XFi group, and that all members of the UK group are members of the XFi.

As I’ve said, I’m keeping an open mind about the XFi - I have yet to hear what membership costs are before I decide if it’s worth joining. Now, it may be much better to be an officially sanction UK branch of XFi (and in principle, I think it will be) - which should bring with it a closer tie with the US group, improved communications with them and help with raising the profile here in the UK. I know that no-one from the USA is going to magic themselves here and make things happen, and that any work will be up to the UK members, but they should be able to offer guidance, maybe resources, and certainly support us in our endeavours (and, hopefully, information will flow the other way too). This is the reason for being tied to XFi.

However, if XFi turns out to be a sticker, a web site and a fee, then I would question whether it’s really worth the close link. This is the Big Doubt in my mind; the flashing lights; the warning. Keeping the friendship but not using the name may be a better option.

I think we need to know more from the XFi organisers about their plans, costs etc. before an informed decision can be made.

Some of you have been in car owner clubs before and know the form. However, I get the feeling that this is a bit of an odd situation. What do other people who collect US cars do in this country? Do they go it alone, or are there ties with US clubs? How do those partnerships work?

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Paul..beeblebrox.. Well said....Your thread is totally correct and echo's Steve-UK proposal/content....This should now put the FXi issues finally to rest..and will allow us to continue as before.

Some of you may have noticed than UKKen is posting a great deal of late!

Well, its like this, I had a birthday last week, and I often have a few current thought's related to our group, idea's and suggestion's..and at my age unless I post then instantly..thay may well be forgotten by the next day!!..

I love my Crossfire but hate my birthdays..and the age old adage of they come around faster as one gets older, is very true. I have another one new week!

Ken :(

Re: UK Crossfires - A Proposal
 

Paul..should have been now in the sentence, rather than not. my mistake...but reading Steve-UK post should have made it very clear to all..

Sorry Paul, I think your missing the point totally..The Proposal regarding FXi International as submitted by Steve-UK is as clearly stated closed

There is no current plan's that I'm aware of, of using the XFi UK as a badge or logo for our group...unless it voted on to do so.


Cheers

Ken