Thread: Kirks (RIOT) motor thread
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Old Apr 25, 2009 | 07:21 AM
  #107 (permalink)  
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loungn14
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From: Plainfield, IL
Default Re: Kirks (RIOT) motor thread
Originally Posted by cruzinquick
The 24 psi is from Waldig's post even saying he told you he went 23psi and eventually went 24psi. That's where the 24 is coming from. Also 240's but that wasn't so recent.

Here nor there, once again Kirks AFR has always been right on par. He has never had a lean condition register, nor has his car thrown P0171 or P0174 like other forum members have reported. So, lets keep this on task, this is the data from this car.

Originally Posted by cruzinquick

I installed mine and I don't even qualify as shade tree. I didn't use phenolics though. On and ready to go in less than an hour. I done it 3 times each time with new gaskets. After 45 minutes of trying should have gave you an indication that something was not normal. It's STOP and not get on the dyno that day. This was an error in judgement from all 5 present.
Like I said in your other thread. Please read the data and then post. Posts like this are not helping the situation, nor helping the betterment of the forum. The manis were installed in 30 minutes. The car started. Then run to the dyno. After a pull and a half the gasket blew and it was never on the dyno again. It was then troubleshooted. Please read the post

Originally Posted by cruzinquick

Brian, stock gaskets will not work. You can just look at the bend in between runners on the gasket and match it up with the mani's and any shade tree mechanic (myself) can see they are not going to match up. They we hit in the middle of each runner and compress the gasket and not line up. You must use a flat gasket, whether it's from another company or not, but must be flat.

Also my suggestion for spacers would have been a gasket beneath the spacer as well as above the spacer. The spacer could have been out of "decking" by .001 and caused the leak as well. Not one mention of the possibility of the spacer being faulty and causing the leak.
Once again, stock Mercedes gaskets were used. Once again, please read the post. We used 6 mercedes gaskets in testing. 4 with using the phenolic and then 2 when not using the phenolic. Common sense tells you that if there was not a problem with the phenolic before the manis then…..

Originally Posted by cruzinquick

This sounds like a combination of installation error for the boost leak and possibly the mani could have be accidently dropped during shipment or at the shop. Then with all the RTV being used is there no possibility of some getting into the motor? I still find it hard to believe (Brian will be posting "I'm In Denial"), that a boost leak would cause that much damage or even contribute to that severe of damage. More than a few on here have had a boost leak. I had a broken clamp on my ypipe once and could hear it as it was quite obvious. I'm positive I've ran my car as hard as Riot's, possibly harder. When you are familiar with the sounds the car makes (should have been just like ImportLab's) it allows you to distinguish the details in sound differences.
Cruizn, I appreciate the love for needswings. It is very noted. But your reaching here. So, we must have dropped the manis in some kind of perfect way just on the flat gasket area as to place them out of level by a couple of tenths. I wish I had that kind of power or skill.

We all know others here have had boost leaks. Have others here blown the gasket out? Remember we need to talk apples to apples here. Boost leak by the y pipe is definitely not in the same ball park. Now your trying to compare sounds? Bryans car has a full stainless exhaust remember? Stop assuming…your not helping the thread

Originally Posted by cruzinquick

There had to be a possibility of some pre-existing damage in his motor. Maybe putting it away for the winter he didn't feel the difference in loss of performance or the sound of the car?

As I've told you before I think it's outstanding that you would replace his motor for free and then the installation to boot. On one hand it makes EC looks like a saviour but the other hand looks like some admission of fault. You said he beat his motor and if it's entirely his fault then he should have paid the bill or at least owned up to it. He didn't really accept your explanation of running his car cold. He posted and didn't say "hey it's my fault I ran my car cold", more that what was being said. I just percieve it as ethically and morally if I was in your shoes, and I had a smidgen of doubt that it was my fault then I would have done the same as you. It is a testament to your character, but business is business.
There could very well have been pre-existing damage, but like I kept saying we will never know the full details of everything.

Originally Posted by cruzinquick

Fast forward to the replacement motor. Is it equipped with all the same mods as before minus the mani's? Does it have the same tune as before or the one you have on your car? Or ImportLabs already dyno tuned with mani's would have been a good baseline to start from.
Yes, the motor has the 185. The tune is not held in the motor, the two things are not similar at all. The tune and software running in the car is located in the ECU or engine control unit, and that has not left the car. So, in essence the only difference is Kirk now has a ton of less miles right now.


Originally Posted by cruzinquick

From the afr's you posted it would seem you have solved the AFR/Boost issue with the LET tune that seemed to block the 185's into the 11's. Riot is the 1st but also the 1st blown motor in an srt6. The tune and 185 from LET was introduced in May of 2008, and thread after thread of issues (everyone besides BrianBrave with his Speed Innovation tune) getting the 185 to perform at high rpm and boost levels other pullies were performing at. I've told Bulldogger before, the first one to make the 185 reliable, safe, and very fast wins the million dollar award. Riots mods didn't mention a FPR, so why would Waldig go through all the trouble (actually he's unique and would do it anyway, kudo's) if a box tune was available already. Your next meet should yield some killer results.

A youtube video of either SRT6 on the dyno at WOT in 3rd showing 13 or below afrs would be icing on the cake. Brian most of us don't have fancy shops, ok there are a few, but the mani's are probably only a 3 on a scale of 1 to 10 difficulty.
The afr’s posted were done quite a long time ago. The 185 from LET was introduced to the crossfires in may of 08. Please remember that us C32’s guys have been running pullies on the cars since 03-04. (and yes we have the same engine) As far as safe and reliable? There are quite a lot of people running a 185 as their daily driver. RIOT had over a year and over 10k miles on his. Not reliable? I have 22k on mine. Definitely not reliable.

Car was running the same tune and 185 for over a year. The car was dyno'd 2 weeks prior and AFR was averaging 13.8

Manis were installed in about 30 minutes

Car was started and seemed fine

We drove to dyno next door (and no its not LET its fluid motor union0 a different company)

We did a pull. It was ok, but seemed lacking

Did another pull and shutdown half through as gasket blew out (apparently this is us ruining the gaskets they came with according to you)

Then we spent time trying to figure it out- as would anyone else

THE MANI WAS NOT DECKED FLAT- We have pictures and rob redecked them. Would you redeck something that doesnt need to be redecked? Rob states that we warped them during install. Can you warm something that is "flat" by placing it on another flat surface? NO

DO WE HAVE ANOTHER CF WITH MOTOR ISSUES? NO- WHERE DO YOU GET THIS STUFF?

Cruzin, while I appreciate your posts, you are doing nothing to help the situation or better the forum on this topic. Please read through the details before posting incorrect data. LET is in our building. FLUID MOTOR UNION is next door. Once again, stop with the assumptions. No the 185 didn't do this. You don't think its quite odd that after running the same tune and parts for over a year, the day that changes (mani's) are made issues come up?
 
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