Originally Posted by
Mrmiata
You know guys, the only problem I see here with any "group buy" is everyone wants a "guarantee" of horspower. If this was a chevy 350 I could see it, but we've pretty much got uncharted waters here. So how is anybody going to line up one that makes everyone happy with things?
The only "uncharted waters" are in the fitment... An engine is an engine, at the end of the day. Whether it's a Kia or a Koenigsegg, an engine needs air, fuel, and spark. Backpressure should be free enough to allow breathing, but should also have enough to promote healthy combustion. We never asked for a guarantee of horsepower. We asked for a leak-free, nicely fitted set of headers. Speedriven volunteered the optimistic numbers, but frankly I would have been happy with 10 RWHP, as long as they fit and caused no adverse issues (melted plug wires, firewall interference, etc).
Originally Posted by
Mrmiata
Seems the most that could be hoped for is a reputable race performance shop giving it their best shot and what you get is what you get, whether its 5 hp or 20 hp unless someone's willing to drop 5 grand for them to keep prototype designing till they get something.
There's where we disagree. THEY set the GB deposit amount... which means that their bean-counters saw it fit to start the build with a collective $1,000 investment, and a total revenue of $10,000+. Mark-up is generally set to 60% in most dealerships, tuners are no different. Nobody builds this stuff at "cost"... you can't stay in business that way. A reputable race performance shop
came to us, and if anyone has the knowledge and capability, it was Speedriven. We weren't expecting a perfect header from a Starbucks barista... we gave deposits to the "best of the best"... so we thought. Once they set the price point, and we commit, the ownership is theirs at that point. As Steve mentioned, there were 10 buyers in the initial GB and eight additional folks wanting the final product. That's over $18,000 for anyone counting. For $18,000, I would have figured out a way to make horsepower.
Originally Posted by
Mrmiata
My dog is sniffing in this hunt because life is getting ready to change for me and my family. I sh*t you not, 4 horizontals wells go into production Sunday and at that point it's wait about another 30-45 days for division order papers and a paycheck. My wife knows my passion for this car (and is very tolerant..lol) and does not have a problem with me scrapping some off the edges over it. I'm like most of you.. I'd love to have 15-20 hp out of a set but someone tell me how we are going to get there...
That's a blessing that you're so fortunate... But I am pretty sure I've seen you referencing this header build in the BEGi thread, and the references have never been glowing ones. If I didn't know any better, it's almost as if you were amused that this has turned into a nightmare.
How do we get there now? No clue. Hazard to say we won't, this forum is so group-buy-shy that I would honestly be floored to see a new project take off. There have been innovative things I have conjured up (aesthetic only), but I simply don't have the energy to beg for the financial support through a GB. Those same mods, if implemented, will only be done as a one-off.