Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Okay, I've owned my 2005 Crossfire base model for about 5 years now. Love it, great fun to drive. Shortly after purchase, it began to cut out while running, coupled with non starts afterwards until it had cooled. Not knowing much about them then, I took it to a dealer and almost $1,000 later, it was fixed by replacement of the Crank Position Sensor.
(Yes, I know but I've learned a lot since then :rolleyes:
Roll ahead 5 years of trouble free motoring to present day and the same thing happened again. No problem I thought as I knew what the cause was.
I researched the forum as deeply as possible for other causes but banked on fitting a new crank sensor. Did this and the car coughed into life but promptly died again.
Swapped between old and new crank sensors to check but still no luck so I checked the Relay Module for the 3 soldering points, resoldered them and tested. Still no luck.
Then I changed the camshaft position sensor for a new OEM unit this morning.
Car burst into life approx 5 seconds and died again. Subsequent attempts had the starter cranking the engine but still no life.
I add that the CRANK sensor wasn't an OEM item. I did a resistance measurement on old and new crank sensors and got a significant difference between the two so assumed that the new (non OEM) was okay.
So to summarize I've replaced both cam and crank sensors and resoldered the RCM joints.
There's plenty fuel in the tank, I press the brake pedal as normal during start and otherwise there is nothing unusual other than the old girl wont start.
I'm on the point of buying an engine code fault reader but dont want to do that if I'm one step away from fixing the problem.
Anyone out there able to offer ideas please? Much appreciated.

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Have you ever changed out the battery? Our cars are real quarky on the power flow.
Also have a look-see for burnt relays on the RCM. In particular the Fuel Pump Relay....

Attachment 36411

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

[QUOTE=syfi;853099]Have you ever changed out the battery? Our cars are real quarky on the power flow.
Also have a look-see for burnt relays on the RCM. In particular the Fuel Pump Relay....

Attachment 36411[/QUO
When you engage the starter does it turn over at normal speed ? If it does you can eliminate the battery as a cause for no start, pm onehundred80 or ala_xfire and offer them a beer and a sub sandwich and they just might help you, good luck hope you get it fixed.PS : for whatever it's worth my
Humble opinion is that it is fuel related, quote; crank right up and ran for 5 seconds and then it quit, fuse, relay or fuel pump or fuel filter, eliminate what it is not and you will arrive at what it is, do your diagnostic work first and then spend your money on the correct part to change.;)

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

And please share what you find out the problem is to help others in the furure.:confused:

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

First thing I would do is lie on the ground with your head just forward of the passenger side rear tire and have someone switch on the ignition to just before the engage starter position.
See if you can hear the fuel pump running.
If not then check fuses and the relay contacts for the fuel pump in the RCM.

https://www.crossfireforum.org/forum...lays-89869.jpg

( purty piktur courtesy of onehundred80 )

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

1K to replace a CPS? Please tell me there was more work done then just the CPS! A 30,00$ part and what some of our forum experts say is about a 10 change out. Yikes!! Stealership is being to kind, that seems to border on criminality!

I would appreciate recommendations on a reasonably priced code reader. There are so many. Thanks!!��

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Was this one solved. I have went through the RCM repair, but would like to know the outcome of this one.

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Hi all and many thanks for the suggestions but unfortunately, still no luck.
1. Did the 'listen for the fuel pump running' and yes it did.
2. Checked the battery before cranking at 12.04v. While cranking that dropped to around 10v then returned quickly to 12v once cranking ceased.
One thing I forgot to add to my initial post was that on first repair attempt, the change of the crankshaft position sensor, the car did start but I just let it run in the driveway and after about 5 minutes (I guess as everything stated to warm up) it stopped again and wouldn't restart.
To me it seems the problem is electrically based as with a lack of fuel the engine wouldnt start for sure but on this particular problem, the engine just cut off like someone had thrown a switch. Same when it ran in the driveway, no spluttering or coughing, just instantaneous cut off.
Next step is to check the relays in the RCM again but as of right now I'm still scratching my head on this one :(

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Could be the connector on the CPS .........

You could measure for a low voltage AC between the 2 pins ( C3 13 & 26 ) in the PTCM connector while the engine is turning over ...

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Question of getting a code reader I had years ago checked Amazon for a price and printed it and went to Wal Mart and they had the unit I wanted showed my print out to the manager and he matched the Amazon price, it was INNOVA 3100 CanObd2 $82.00 which I keep in my car.

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Thanks again all for the responses.
Unfortunately the old girl still refuses to kick into life.
I did locate the PTCM but unfortunately couldn't identify the plug terminals C3, 13 & 26. I followed the wires back from the crank position sensor to where they entered the loom then followed that piece of loom back to the PCM. I counted 9 cores on the diagram and looked for a connector with 9 cores but none found. 10 cores, 7 cores and another with 20ish cores but nothing like that going in the direction of the crank sensor.
Not being familiar with the fuel pump mentioned in earlier thread, there is a quiet fan like noise when the ignition is switched on. I'm assuming that's the fuel pump running.
I'm at a real loss here but don't want to hand it to a dealer for them to add double '00's' or even triple zero $$$ to something I may be able to do myself if I can only identify what the problem is! Very frustrating.
Back to the purchase of a code scanner, does anyone think this might be able to help me identify the cause of this or will it just give me a load of information I can't use or dont need?
Again, appreciate everyone's assistance on this. Thanks,

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Am I to understand that the CPS you put in was not a Bosch part?
Because many of the aftermaket ones have caused all sorts of issues.

If yours is some offbrand, order one here and THEN see where you stand:
https://www.germanautosupply.com/sto...sensor-95.html

As to code readers, they are super cheap (well, compared to paying a dealership $1000 for a $47 part and 20 minutes of labor) and anyone who is trying to diagnose their car without one is being foolish.

Yes, foolish - for $30 to $100 you can read what ever codes the PTCM is generating. AND, if there is NO code in THIS situation, I'd most likely guess you have low fuel pressure or a crappy battery. To try to diagnose a modern car (ANY car, not just ours) without a code reader is like walking in the dark at night, trying to find the path home - you MIGHT stumble on it - but you more likely will just stumble around all night...

One more thing, if you hear a fan sound down in the box holding the RCM, that is a fan - it's the cooling fan that draws cabin air into the box to keep things cool AND to force a slight pressure in the box to keep out dust. That is why that box stays so clean.

I admit that I never hear my fuel pump - but I'm going deaf due to so much driving around with the top down.

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Force the relay contact closed on the fuel pump relay in the RCM (wedge something in there). Have seen this relay work/not work at random.
If the car runs and continues to run, taa-daa, bad relay.

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Agreed on the OBD2 scan tool necessity and low price, I bought this one for $14 and it's fine for basic read/erase:

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Thanks everyone again all for the advice.
I've ordered a new Bosch crank sensor and will try that once it arrives.
Unfortunately I have to travel a lot so have had to put the old girl back in the garage and await my return. Looking forward to trying the new part and fingers crossed the problem is resolved.
I'll keep the thread going and meanwhile wish everyone a thank you and an enjoyable Thanksgiving.

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

I'm encountering the same thing. I had my RCM resoldered months ago by a guy on this forum and that worked perfect. Recently the car died and I replaced the crankshaft position sensor two weeks ago and the car worked until last week when it died while I was driving on the highway. Had to tow it home. Replaced the crankshaft position sensor again and same no start or will start and die. Changed the camshaft position sensor today and same nothing, will start but shuts off. Just towed it to a mechanic. Hopefully it's under my warranty. What finally fixed your problem?

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Go down to Autozone or AdvanceAuto and have them check for any error codes, or find someone that has a OBD II code reader. They should do it for free. List any found codes and then we can go from there.....

Re: Crossfire won't start, help!
 

Success!!! So after changing both crank and camshaft sensors, resoldering the 3 joints on the RCM and having no luck, I stood and held the fuel pump contacts closed while my good lady cranked her over. Brmmmm, burst into life! So my problem was no fuel due to a faulty fuel pump relay in the RCM but despite following the good advice from the forum, I wasn't quite looking at all the areas recommended. Still not being totally convinced, I bought a cheap RCM module on EBay ($75) almost as a last resort and installed with immediate success. Frustrating and more expensive than it should have been by changing components that weren't the real problem but very happy that I finally fixed it without resorting to the local stealership. Thanks to all who gave those great tips and descriptions, I couldn't have achieved this without them.