Let the IC deal with the high load from the charge air cooler and the ambient temps (60-90F) and let the KC deal with the AC temps (35-40). If you ran your KC output through the IC - you've moved closer to ambient and your IC will not perform - lets get the most out of that and the free air flow across it before we demand of the KC.
Delta T is your friend here.

the intercooler is under the supercharger and has zero air passing thru it to cool. it cools by passing fluid thru the hot supercharged air. that fluid then goes to the HEAT EXCHANGER to be cooled. by using the killer chiller and not the h/e you are running the fluid thru the freon to cool the fluid. its lower temp than the air passing thru the h/e so it must be eliminated from the system while the k/c is in use. otherwise it actually raises the already low temps.
your terms are getting you confused. intercooler is under the s/c and heat exchanger is in front of the radiator . while both perform the same function the names are different to separete them

 

Thanks Steve. Snow's new controller is exactly what aquamist has. Both expensive...lol I think I will just do the kit, then I can add this control to the system if I want to really get it down to damn near perfect. It can be installed later on.... I have enough on my plate right now...keep working on that chiller.... If nothing else it might keep our beer cold..

 

You picked me up on this before - so I thought I updated all my references to comply (obviously not).
Just checked the X-fire Manual p 619- ...
".....The purpose of the charge air cooler is to reduce the air inlet temperature thereby increasing air density thus producing an increase in engine efficiency. The charge air cooler operates as an air-to-water heat exchanger. The charge air cooler extracts heat from the incoming compressed air, leaving the supercharger. Transfering the heat in the air to the to the coolant in the charge air cooler. The hot coolant is then circulated to the charge air cooler radiator where it is cooled...."

 

I'm back with updates. Better late than never. I spent an hour or so on the dyno doing nothing more than playing with the injection. My purpose was to use the injection to reach the AFR's that I want. (lean tune) The tank has 2 pints of alcohol and distilled water. I poured in the 2 pints and topped off the stock washer tank so the exact mixture is a mystery but I imagine around 60/40 water to alcohol. The adjustment screws don't have numbers on them, just slash marks so to have an idea where it's at it's necessary to go to 0 and count as you turn the screw. I tried just about every combination. Spraying early, intermediate and late. Reaching full volume early late and never etc. and all combinations in between. For my purposes the best setting has it coming on around 10 PSI and I have the maximum set at 30 PSI. In other words, it never reaches full volume. This is with the 5 gph nozzle (315cc). No horsepower increase from spraying. None. These kits make power because they allow you to take risks with extra timing Y/O a leaner mixture. At this point in time I'm not willing to risk much. Perhaps in the future I'll get an Eurotuner for multiple tunes. With my setup I have the option of using less meth for more power (leaner mixture) if I grow a pair big enough. I've used my car with 104 octane and AFR's around 13 with no ill effects but ... the swelling went down and I decided safe is better. With AFR's in the mid 13's I make 25 more HP and 15 ft. lbs. more torque for reference. As far as cooling the IAT's .... so far I don't have enough data but it's minimal at best. Spraying through the supercharger and the intercooler won't allow much. The intercooler reheats the air. The supercharger stays cool. Any questions Doc? My early conclusions are, tune for it and don't you dare come close to running out or BOOM. If you want lower IAT's don't spray before the throttle body.

Les

 

I am set Les...just need to do the install. I am only looking at "not pulling timing" feature of using the meth. My runs hopefully will be in the 11.7 second range...unlike your runs...lol. So I am not worried about 'booms".....thanks for the update.
PS...I am laying out the Dashdaq/Zietronics as we type. I still need to mach up a mounting plate for the small battery/pump/tank combination where the normal size battery sets today. I hope to have that done this week. Wish I had access to a milling machine, lol, but I don't so it will be simply done... I have a lot of wiring here...lol Wish me luck...

 

Best of luck with the instal Doc. Getting it all neatly into the cabin is time consuming but not difficult. I don't think your loosing timing during the 1/4 mile unless you have lousy gas. My IAT's reached close to 180º in the 1/2 mile event and the timing stayed pat at 24º btdc.

Les

 

Well, that is the problem Les. Without the monitoring, I just don't know. I fell off with the roadster near the end of the 1/4. The coupe feels differently, as it is still pulling. So, until I can data log, I won't know for sure where I need to go. The meth might not be needed, but it is going on there, as it certainly can't hurt with a S/C'd car. Once I can log some runs, and tweak my tune. I will add that tune to the roadster. I'm only going to monitor the coupe. But, the roadster is getting all the same parts less the meth. I was just going to keep the roadster the way it was, but, what the hell, this way I will always be ready. LOL... Sometimes I carry my Glock off duty, sometimes I carry my Colt 45...both are capable....lol.... thanks again buddy

 

Datalog your short term knock with and without the spray. If you can keep short term knock from pulling engine timing, then your spray is helping you maintain what you have. Also, no mention of checking exhaust gas temps. On my turbocharged 5.7 Hemi, if I turn off the spray, EGT's will jump 250+ degrees, and loads of short term knock timing correction.

 

I am monitoring exhaust gas as well. Hell I'm monitoring everything w/ the zeitronics. I have been putting bungs everywhere...may even put one under the driver's seat....lol...

 

I was planning on adding a thermo coupler to my Speedriven headers ...... guess where that plan swirled down.

Les

 

Hell, Les, I have been a year getting this far.... My plan is to finish the coupe this year be ready for next year now...going the 1/8 mile route. Then hopefully economy willing, set the roadster up for some SCCA stuff....not sure what yet, as I am still reading the rule book, but something fun. When I retire from the Sheriff gig, my weekends will be free again....so, I need a hobby that is fun... Wish I could do what you do, but that isn't easy or cheap around here... WE just keep, keepin' on...lol Keeps us young, and broke lol....

 

I decided to come back here and add the latest information that renders all prior information null and void. I'll start with some background. I've had problems with my tunes. A "normal works for everyone else" tune has been way off on my car. My IAT's have been over what the average owner sees. Water meth has done NOTHING to help my IAT's. So I start messing with my heat exchangers. I pulled the supercooler and went back to the stock heat exchanger with a remote reservoir. I pumped out water without reaching boiling temperatures. I figured it must have boiled somewhere in the loop. Next event I bumped up against the supercharger over temp. So I pulled the stock heat exchanger and put in an E55 AMG heat exchanger. Another event and I'm pushing water out the reservoir. WTF! No overtemp, 180º IAT's. Then I started thinking about my intercooler leak and ....... well duh. The boost is pressurizing the I/C circuit, pumping water out, interfering with the cooling, making me chase my tail and waste time. Now my local tuner that doesn't tune Crossfires tells me a leak changes a tune. Another piece falls in place. It's likely the reason injecting water/meth hasn't lowered my IAT's. I never suspected the leak would cause these issues. I figured, a little water won't hurt anything, if you can spray water for cooling a little leak won't cause any real problems. A new intercooler has been ordered. When it's installed and tested I'll come back again with the real results. BTW, the car runs great. Just hot and I've had to retune like crazy and will likely have to retune some more after the leak is eliminated.

Les

 

Well, Les...I think we need a re-designed inner cooler that will hold up. I am not going to monitor exhaust after all. I don't think there is a need, but I am up to running the wiring finally. So next weekend will be dedicated to wiring the zeitronics. Have a new laptop and all the software loaded and ready. I have the dashdaq situated where I want it. The meth, will get wired up at the same time...still working on fitting a tank, pump, into place...so, let's hope it does something to keep her cooler...if not, it's a $350 bust...

 

What it does even with my leaky intercooler is ..... drop your AFR's a full point. So, if your at 11.8 with a 50/50 mix your around 10.8. A retune will be in order. I had Eurocharged reinstall a prior lean tune and I adjusted it with the meth concentration. I'm running 60/40 at the time to be at 11.8. Without the meth my car is around 13 AFR's. I go through a gallon during a track day. I turn it on while on the street but rarely push the pedal enough to use much. Mine starts spraying at 10 PSI.

Les

 

would I be correct in thinking the lower AFR is because H2Ovap is displacing some O2 (measured by Lambda probe)?

Since we dont have H2O sensors in our intakes....I'm guessing the ECU "assumes"21vol% O2 in the intake air ie: <0.1vol% H2O.

Subsequently when you use water, suddenly it goes up to 0.6vol% or whatever and your O2 goes down from 20.5 to sub 20's. A 5% reduction in O2 would be the same as a 5% reduction in AFR or 0.6*. But hey - you've kicked 5kW or heat out of the system - that's huge!

*based on 4.5oz/min H2O into 640cfm.

 

Spraying 100% water didn't affect the AFR's. It's the methanol that lowers them. Neither changed the power positively. A tune specific for the spray would be needed.

Les

 

Related but different, does anyone know where the piping diagram for the I/C ( input and output ) lines can be viewed?? I need to follow the water path.

I need to check out something which is related to the water circuit in the I/C??

I did a bit of a search, kinda low on time now. Woody

 

hmmm...not sure what you are specifically asking as I thought this was freely available - but heck I'll post it anyways....
computer says....I posted this earlier in the thread....got around that though

 

Is this what you want?

 

PERFECT, thanks. Woody