A day that will live in infamy
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Location: Fort Worth, Texas
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Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Age: 64
Posts: 13,469
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692 Posts
Re: A day that will live in infamy
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Fort Worth, Texas
Age: 64
Posts: 13,469
Received 888 Likes
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692 Posts
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Dallas, the Republic of Texas
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Re: A day that will live in infamy
Casualties
USA : 218 KIA, 364 WIA.
USN: 2,008 KIA, 710 WIA.
USMC: 109 KIA, 69 WIA.
Civilians: 68 KIA, 35 WIA.
TOTAL: 2,403 KIA, 1,178 WIA.
Battleships
USS Arizona (BB-39) - total loss when a bomb hit her magazine.
USS Oklahoma (BB-37) - Total loss when she capsized and sunk in the harbor.
USS California (BB-44) - Sunk at her berth. Later raised and repaired.
USS West Virginia (BB-48) - Sunk at her berth. Later raised and repaired.
USS Nevada - (BB-36) Beached to prevent sinking. Later repaired.
USS Pennsylvania (BB-38) - Light damage.
USS Maryland (BB-46) - Light damage.
USS Tennessee (BB-43) Light damage.
USS Utah (AG-16) - (former battleship used as a target) - Sunk.
Cruisers
USS New Orleans (CA-32) - Light Damage.
USS San Francisco (CA38) - Light Damage.
USS Detroit (CL-8) - Light Damage.
USS Raleigh (CL-7) - Heavily damaged but repaired.
USS Helena (CL-50) - Light Damage.
USS Honolulu (CL-48) - Light Damage.
Destroyers
USS Downes (DD-375) - Destroyed. Parts salvaged.
USS Cassin - (DD-372) Destroyed. Parts salvaged.
USS Shaw (DD-373) - Very heavy damage.
USS Helm (DD-388) - Light Damage.
Minelayer
USS Ogala (CM-4) - Sunk but later raised and repaired.
Seaplane Tender
USS Curtiss (AV-4) - Severely damaged but later repaired.
Repair Ship
USS Vestal (AR-4) - Severely damaged but later repaired.
Harbor Tug
USS Sotoyomo (YT-9) - Sunk but later raised and repaired.
Aircraft
188 Aircraft destroyed (92 USN and 92 U.S. Army Air Corps.)
USA : 218 KIA, 364 WIA.
USN: 2,008 KIA, 710 WIA.
USMC: 109 KIA, 69 WIA.
Civilians: 68 KIA, 35 WIA.
TOTAL: 2,403 KIA, 1,178 WIA.
Battleships
USS Arizona (BB-39) - total loss when a bomb hit her magazine.
USS Oklahoma (BB-37) - Total loss when she capsized and sunk in the harbor.
USS California (BB-44) - Sunk at her berth. Later raised and repaired.
USS West Virginia (BB-48) - Sunk at her berth. Later raised and repaired.
USS Nevada - (BB-36) Beached to prevent sinking. Later repaired.
USS Pennsylvania (BB-38) - Light damage.
USS Maryland (BB-46) - Light damage.
USS Tennessee (BB-43) Light damage.
USS Utah (AG-16) - (former battleship used as a target) - Sunk.
Cruisers
USS New Orleans (CA-32) - Light Damage.
USS San Francisco (CA38) - Light Damage.
USS Detroit (CL-8) - Light Damage.
USS Raleigh (CL-7) - Heavily damaged but repaired.
USS Helena (CL-50) - Light Damage.
USS Honolulu (CL-48) - Light Damage.
Destroyers
USS Downes (DD-375) - Destroyed. Parts salvaged.
USS Cassin - (DD-372) Destroyed. Parts salvaged.
USS Shaw (DD-373) - Very heavy damage.
USS Helm (DD-388) - Light Damage.
Minelayer
USS Ogala (CM-4) - Sunk but later raised and repaired.
Seaplane Tender
USS Curtiss (AV-4) - Severely damaged but later repaired.
Repair Ship
USS Vestal (AR-4) - Severely damaged but later repaired.
Harbor Tug
USS Sotoyomo (YT-9) - Sunk but later raised and repaired.
Aircraft
188 Aircraft destroyed (92 USN and 92 U.S. Army Air Corps.)
Join Date: Jun 2009
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Re: A day that will live in infamy
Well, the case can be made that the Germans never attacked us in a "cowardly" way.
The Japanese did... but even then, it was not their INTENT to do so. Their declaration of war was inadvertently delayed - or so it seems. A 'snafu' on their part.
Of course, there WERE German subs off the Atlantic shore...
The Japanese did... but even then, it was not their INTENT to do so. Their declaration of war was inadvertently delayed - or so it seems. A 'snafu' on their part.
Of course, there WERE German subs off the Atlantic shore...
Re: A day that will live in infamy
Originally Posted by pizzaguy
Yea, but my problem is, my son married a Japanese girl in 2002.
Hard to think of a daughter in law as a "child of the enemy".
I guess time, enough time, and things are... different.
But I can still remember, and honor those who served.
Hard to think of a daughter in law as a "child of the enemy".
I guess time, enough time, and things are... different.
But I can still remember, and honor those who served.
I knew men who had been prisoners and one who met prisoners coming from the POW camps, the stories were horrific, a mini Holocaust. This applied to all of the Allied POW's.
Pearl Harbor was just the start for the US, others had been at it for a while.
Tragically Pearl Harbor was a godsend to the Allies fighting already and started a war that Japan could not win.
What a waste it all was.
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Re: A day that will live in infamy
Originally Posted by mike shelley
I've aiways found it interesting that some people refuse to buy Japanese cars because of Pearl Harbor but have no problem owning a German car.
Germany did these things and more, and I was more affected by the Germans in the war, little things like huddling in a shelter while being bombed in London and having to move because the house was shattered making it unsafe. Having the country bankrupted, food rationed during and after the war for five years plus. Others had it much much worse of course.
As you probably wasn't even born at that time maybe you cannot understand my reasoning and monuments to dead armed forces members are just stones laying around town.
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Re: A day that will live in infamy
The guy who first trained me at RCA in 1981 retired that year. He was a crewmember on either a B17 or B24 over Germany. They were shot down, and he broke a leg either in the hit, or on his way down under a parachute.
He was captured right away, he said that was a good thing, as civilians treated them badly, treatment from the German military machine was not so bad. He spent considerable time in a POW camp. He said that, while he received virtually no treatment for his injury from the Germans ( they really had problems treating their OWN wounded), the war, by then, was not going well at all for the Germans and they had little to offer their own, let alone prisoners.
He said that he was never tortured, but the food was not good - again, things were bad for Germany at the time.
He commented that it wasn't like "Hogan 's Heros", but that he and his fellow POW's DID have reasonable conversations with the Germans at times. "It was war, and most of us on both sides were following orders and doing what we had to, to survive. Of course, by then, there was a movement in Germany against the war and against the leadership. They were losing their country because of the war and knew it."
Larry is gone now, he died in the 90's. But not before telling his story (finally) on the printed page. If you visit the Kalamazoo Aviation History museum, his story might still be on display. It was in the late 90's.
He was captured right away, he said that was a good thing, as civilians treated them badly, treatment from the German military machine was not so bad. He spent considerable time in a POW camp. He said that, while he received virtually no treatment for his injury from the Germans ( they really had problems treating their OWN wounded), the war, by then, was not going well at all for the Germans and they had little to offer their own, let alone prisoners.
He said that he was never tortured, but the food was not good - again, things were bad for Germany at the time.
He commented that it wasn't like "Hogan 's Heros", but that he and his fellow POW's DID have reasonable conversations with the Germans at times. "It was war, and most of us on both sides were following orders and doing what we had to, to survive. Of course, by then, there was a movement in Germany against the war and against the leadership. They were losing their country because of the war and knew it."
Larry is gone now, he died in the 90's. But not before telling his story (finally) on the printed page. If you visit the Kalamazoo Aviation History museum, his story might still be on display. It was in the late 90's.
Re: A day that will live in infamy
Originally Posted by pizzaguy
It was a waste, but it also DID, in the end, unknowingly signal the end of the war.
A sleeping giant is *****-slapped and awakened.
Many died and then:
One lone airplane.
Two bombs with silly names.
And it was OVER.
A sleeping giant is *****-slapped and awakened.
Many died and then:
One lone airplane.
Two bombs with silly names.
And it was OVER.
Theres nothing like a war to improve the technology of war and give you a chance to rapidly improve your weapons systems many times over.
PS Two bombs, two planes.
Last edited by onehundred80; 12-07-2009 at 03:51 PM.
Re: A day that will live in infamy
Originally Posted by pizzaguy
It was a waste, but it also DID, in the end, unknowingly signal the end of the war.
A sleeping giant is *****-slapped and awakened.
Many died and then:
One lone airplane.
Two bombs with silly names.
And it was OVER.
A sleeping giant is *****-slapped and awakened.
Many died and then:
One lone airplane.
Two bombs with silly names.
And it was OVER.
Actually, two planes, The Enola Gay, and Bock's Car They dropped Fat Man and Little Boy over Hiroshima and Nagasaki
Re: A day that will live in infamy
Originally Posted by mike shelley
I've aiways found it interesting that some people refuse to buy Japanese cars because of Pearl Harbor but have no problem owning a German car.
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