A long and winding tale

I’ve been cursing my Eibach’s for a while now. My first track event after installing them the car was wicked loose near the limit. Since then I’ve changed air pressures, shock settings, driving style, alighment etc. All to no avail. Why o why didn’t I spend the money and get K&W’s from the start. Dad always told me cheap was expensive. So here I am thinking of selling my Eibach’s to some poor sap ……. No I wouldn’t do that, TO THE TRASH WITH THE SUCKERS!! Get on the internet and start looking at the K&W’s again and find the disclaimer about certain body modifications. Ah, now I remember why I decided to go cheap. Dig a little more and run across this phrase “notching the frame may be necessary” Oh kriky! (I figured it out inmediately) So today I went down to the car, jacked it up, pulled off the rear wheels and sure enough, take a look at the pictures.

Now it’s hard to tell how much more room the sway bar needs. I’m thinking ½ inch. So what I would like for all of you to opine on is this. Do you think this interference problem that I’ve uncovered is the reason my car is soo loose at the limit? Or do you think it shouldn’t have a drastic affect on the handling.

Perhaps I’ve been placing the blame on the springs when all the while it was an interference issue from lowering the car. We’ll find out soon. When my BBK arrives I’ll get out the grinder and some black paint of course, and clearance the frame, or put in a dot 2 or 3 spring rubber.

So, did I find the problem? Notch the frame or replace the spring rubber.

All that have lowered your cars and drive it at the limit should verify this clearance. I have the Eibach’s and Dot 1 pads on the rear.

Les

 

Should you decide to trash them, please give me the opportunity to take them off your hands.

 

too funny.....as for the roadster, it has a push, but, not that bad a car on the track...suspension has to be able to work, so, if it is in the middle of flexing, then hits a stop, this could cause you to think you are loose. I would add the spacers, cutting into the body is never good...you, know if you are on the track all the time, maybe it is time to invest in some racing tires, slicks to be exact...groove them if need be, but they would stick for you when heated up....just an observation....my poor F1's didn't last 5K with me playing all the time...I will finish them off this summer....just 2 summers out of them...lol

 

I currently have Michelin Pilot Sport Cups like Jane has. They are R compound and really stick. The car feels good in the corners and then suddenly it lets go. I've lost the car twice and almost several more times. Once was a 360 in the middle of the track. It's most unstable during high speed transitions like an es section at 80 or higher. (where I lost it) Before changing the springs and putting on R compound tires I had a good balance. When the car reached the traction limit it would go into a 4 wheel drift. Fun and confidence inspiring.
Where a relief is needed is not a boxed section. It's more of a lip so I don't think it would hurt anything. But I'm leaning towards a thicker spring pad.

Les

 

i would try a #2 pad first. what shocks do you have? are they adjustable? if not maybe some adj. konis' so you can firm up the ride

 

The trashing comment was frustration talking. If my work picks up the Eibachs and Koni's will be coming out and coilovers going in, but don't hold your breath. I need new tires soon, a BBK is on the way and the budget is already broken. (Bmorgan, you'll get first crack at them)

From my last track day I learned a few things. I'm as fast as anybody on the straights, I'm getting killed under braking by the better cars, and my car is pitiful in the esses. And I pushed it enough in the esses to almost loose it and pushed it under braking until I melted the pads and boiled the fluid. I have Motul 600, Stoptech's with Carbotech pads on the way. Now I have to fix this suspension gremlin. I assume I found the reason for the sudden lack of grip at the limit. We'll see. I intend to fix this problem before next weekend when I have another event on a slower curvier track. I'll keep this updated so fellow Crossfire owners can learn from my persistence.

Les

 

I decided to put the Dot 3 spring rubbers in myself. What a piece of cake! I was worried about getting things back together but it went real smooth. It took me 2 hours to do the work from collecting the tools to washing up after finishing. It turns out my adjustable upper camber links are also making contact with the sway bar. Everyone that bought adjustable upper links should take a rear tire off and see if it's making contact. The stock links are curved and now I understand why. Without further ado a few more pictures. The blue link is my aftermarket adjustable link. A picture of a Dot 1 pad and Dot 3 pad. And a picture of things apart.

I hope this takes care of my interference problems. Love those Eibachs.

Les

This morning I put paint on the metal where the parts were making contact and went for a test drive. I think I may have raised it enough.

 

Well after a test drive the contact between parts continues. Since everyone and their brothers have Eibachs with no interference, that only leaves the camber links as the culprit.

fast forward --- So I just got finished putting the stock links back on the car. After seeing the clearance with the aftermarket links and the stock ones, it's pretty obvious that the links were contacting the sway bar and forcing it up into the frame. Imagine selling adjustable links for lowered cars that can't be lowered or the links contact other parts. Boy was I ripped off.

Track day is Sunday. I hope the changes result in faster times around the track. My best time is 59.1xx.

Les

 

It's been a long time since I updated this thread but lots of things have changed. I yanked the Eibach's and installed cut SRT-6 springs. (its now lower in the rear than with the Eibachs) A little later I bought Speedy Benz's adjustable camber arms. I discovered that while the contact with the sway bar and camber arms was less it was still occurring so I put in Dot 4 spring pads too. The car is very predictable and fast but I still have some contact at the cornering limits. I plan on installing the Eibachs in the rear with the Dot 4 pads which should raise the rear 8 mm. I hope this solves the contact without hurting the handling of the car. While I have the suspension apart I plan on putting it back together without the spring and jacking it all the way up to see what's hitting where and in what order. I'll report back with the results of the overdue exploratory and second chance for the Eibachs.

Les

 

Sweet. I'm interested to see what you find out!

 

As usual, interesting and informative, Thanks Les.Any info on the Needswings down pipes yet?

 

I clayed and waxed them and admire them every day! No, not installed yet. I have a few details to iron out before they go in. Even after they're installed I won't have track times to compare until the end of January. I do plan to have a dyno done after they're in for a week. I remember 240 saying that he lost power taking the cats off so I'm not getting my hopes too high. On the other hand, Needswings hasn't sold me a single part that let me down.

Les

By the way, I'm looking at buying Enkei RPF-1's, 18x9's on all corners. I just don't know how its going to look on the front. My measurements say it should be fine with a 235/40/18.

 

Today I put the Eibach's in the rear with dot 4 pads and it lifted 1". Here's a picture without the spring installed and with the suspension lifted. (not to the maximum) As you can see the camber arm contacts the sway bar which in turn, if under enough pressure, pushes the sway bar into the frame. You can see the indentations from past contact. One indisputable fact is the Eibachs give a nice ride. I hope this solves my problem and that the Eibachs don't slow me down. If I'm slower with the Eibachs I'll be buying someones stock SRT springs and cut a little less off of them.

Les

I never update my times. With the Eibachs I had a best time of 59.xx, I can't remember the exact hundreths. With the cut SRT springs I lowered my times to a best of 56.666. A huge difference on a short track with lots of turns. The front alignment has stayed consistent. The rear I've changed numerous times. Now I have the rear alignment dialed in so I'll know for sure how the Eibachs affect my speed around the track.

 

les dont forget about the upper control arm suspension bolt in the front. my 18 x 8.5 were extremely close when installed. no spacers but only 6mm of clearance. no issues so far but a little unnerving at first

 

This picture was taken near the traction limits and you can see how far the rear is compressed.

Les

 

nice read Les...just purchased a book on suspensions....brushing up....don't think I will build one for going round and round, but would like it to be a little more predictable...