I live in the Kansas City area and had been buying my gasoline on the Mo. side for several years because it was always 10 cents cheaper there due to higher Kansas taxes. Starting about a year ago I noticed our cars were getting fewer mpg. Seemed like as much as 3-4 mpg fewer. I found out recently all Mo. gas is now 10% ETOH & they don't have to tell you on the pump.......switched to Kansas gas......wow.....getting much better mileage now.....Crossfire went from 23.2 mpg to 27.1mpg!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It's worth the extra 10 cents for real gas!!! Since the switch I've driven 575 miles on 21.2 gal. =27.1 mpg. I'm convinced top horsepower is improved too!

 

And once again, the fallacy of "Ethanol" becomes apparent. There is only half as much energy in a gallon of ETOH as Base gasoline. But the retail outlet can charge as much for the fuel. It does improve octane.

Farm Lobby wants you to burn corn in your car. And now your food costs more as well. Corn was $80.00 a ton in 2007. Now it's at $ 240.00 a ton.

Could this have something to do with $4.00 a gallon gas? I don't know but something is not Kosher here. Last year saw more oil pumped than ever before. There is no shortage of oil. It also saw record corn production when farmers (including those big corporate farms) switched crops from wheat and beans to meet the anticipated demand for ethanol.

And now wheat is @ $12.40 per bushel and bread will cost almost twice as much as it did in 2006. This despite the ineffeciency of making ethanol.

In the end, your car gets lower milage as you drive home the bacon that cost twice as much at the store. The Na-sayers were right, Ethanol is a bust.

It kinda reminds me of that Electric Supercharger thingy. Sounds cool until you actualy get past the BS and do the math.

roadster with a stick.

 

Despite all the problems with Ethanol there are some facts that cannot be discussed off the table:

-) It burns cleaner (there is NO sulphur in ethanol to begin with)
-) The CO2 load of Ethanol is negative (it takes more carbon to make ethanol than you emit, effectively cleaning the atmosphere)

Yes, more expensive
Yes, less energy content (I wish they had a similar system as they have with diesel where the energy content of the fuel is also part of the equation)

 

Franc, looks like you're a Mo. resident.....am I correct.....is 10% ETOH content mandatory in Mo. now?

Andreas, don't get me wrong.....if people "want" to burn ETOH....fine......but I think you should have a choice & that it should be mandatory to state on the pump what it is you're getting.

 

Agreed. It would be 'nice' if they let you know what you are getting.

 

Chrs,
Yes it is mandatory. And it happened under a Republican legislature and govenor.
Many of the "Bread Basket" states have similar requirments. I'm pretty sure Iowa does along with Illinois. Not positive. There are all kinds of tax incentives for participating in ETOH production from the farm to retail outlets nationwide. It may not be required but not going along can hurt. The whole industry is being coerced into this and you can bet, the bean counters will care little about you and me and our right to chose.

Tells you how much power the farm lobby has.

Roadster with a stick.

 

Several states now mandate the use of Ethanol in their gasoline including many states out East. The problem with this is that the Eastern US does not produce the corn-based Ethanol (it is possible to produce Ethanol from sugar cane though production hasn't really started yet & folks are still researching other crops to use) it now has to get to meet the mandates. Now think about this for a moment: the East can't produce the Ethanol they need to use by law so how does it get there? By diesel-using tankers only. Ethanol distribution systems (meaning pipelines) are not being built & Ethanol cannot be run through the same pipelines we use for oil-based products, indeed it can damage the pipelines themselves.
As far as I know, here in this state, distributors must state that Ethanol is in the gasoline you buy though we do not have a state mandate to do so. I know at our company we only mix with gasoline when the price of the Ethanol is less than the price of the bulk gasoline. That hasn't been the case of late. Just like Franc says, we keep our prices the same with or without the Ethanol present. And yes, I do think it's a rip!

 

I kinda figured that the differentiator was the additives but had no facts to support it.

So what is the 411 on the additives? My buddy's wife's car had issues and he swears it was due to filling up with ARCO gas. Any inside info on this is surely appreciated.

 

Apleschu,

Don't get me wrong. Ethanol is a great product, it has it's benefits for sure.

I simply object to the fact that all we hear about is how "fuel from corn we grow here in the good ole USA" is going to solve our oil crisis. The whole story of what it will do to our food supply and ecology is not truthfully told by ETOH proponents or our elected officials. These are people sworn to the public trust and owe their constituents the truth.

For instance, it is a widely held belief that the byproducts of ethanol production can be used as cattle feed. Makes no logical sense as the sugar in the feed is gone after ETOH processing. What's left is mostly cellulose fiber. Cows have two stomachs because their digestive system is inefficient. They must "chew their cud" to get the starches and sugars removed from the grass plant for simple digestion in their secondary stomach. The post ethanol cellulose fiber has little or no food value. Cattlemen can only add 20% of the crap to the feed or it will KILL THE COW.
So what are we going to do with the rest of the cellulose? I'm sure someone will come up with uses but right now it is going to landfills which is not pleasing the evironmentalists for sure. They now don't know which side of the argument to be on. I find it amusing.

If every square foot of arible land was converted to corn, we still could not supply enough ethanol to power our vehicles. And we would starve. The number of Ethanol plants planned by the government cannot be supplied by our current level of corn production, even if we stopped feeding it to the cattle and chickens we eat. Very amusing.

Bottom line here is this, as with most things out of Washington, we don't get the whole story untill it's a government program that cannot be fixed or killed.The free market forces that would have made the economic unviability of ethanol apparent, were thwarted by government subsidies and "the best of intentions."

Meanwhile our taxes go up to support it and relatively cheap food becomes dear.


Enjoy


roadster with a stick

 

Ethanol Fallacy.

Checkout this website;
www.foxnew.com/story/0,2933,352968,00.html
One year into the new mandates and trouble, serious trouble is brewing.
34% of last year's corn crop went into the program and gas is now at $ 4.00 a gallon.
The experts said that ethanol would not be commercially viable unless oil went to $90.00 per barrel.
Since no one seems able to explain why oil is so high, I have a simple suggestion.....

Perhaps it is just a coincidence.

roadster with a stick

 

My friend tested out many different fuels and came to the conclusion that Citgo had the best for anti knock, with Chevron a close second. So I've been using Citgo ever since. And if I wanted to raise the octane at the track, I just add 1 gallon of the 100 race fuel to my 1/4 tank of 93.

 

Here in Ontario most gas contains at least 10% ethanol. Which if Iam not mistaken is required by law. I belive that will increase to 15% in the next few years. An number of OEM's sell cars and trucks that are E85. (GM and Chyrsler) yet I couldnot tell where one ethanol station is in this province.