Sorry John but God does not ask us to emulate Him. The evils of which you speak are the weaknesses of man not God. allof thtwhich you swpeak is from God but it was not meant to be easy.
For if it was easy, if there was no choice of good or bad, then, what would be the point?
You speak of the path of life as though it ought to be a simple matter with no chance of failure. No struggle. How enjoyable would that life be? What reward would make sufficient the effort?

With all due respect sir, God does not choose priests to defile children. But would you not find satisfaction in having chosen to omit that abomination from your life. Were it not for the right and wrong of it, how would you know? This, as of all things, comes from Him.

It is not my intention to convince or convert. Each must find their own way and no one, believer or unbeliever, should show disrespect for the other. Please accept my hunble contributions to the discussion simply as witness to my views of the subject.


franc

 

Very well said. I respect your opinions as well. I've been there. I can assure you, one of the most difficult, scariest, things I've ever done is my life was coming to the acceptance that our current gods are no different than any of the other gods man has created through history. I spent years waiting for the lightning bolt to strike me down. Since then, I have come to realize the importance of organized religion in our societies.

But it was not a god who asked me to emulate a god, it was JHM2K.

"What is the "form" of which you wish to model yourself by? Other flawed humans?"
"Not trying to be crass, I'm seriously wondering what one uses as a benchmark if there is no tangible relationship with a Creator?"

The idea is ludicrous. Any reasonable, intelligent, human can discern right from wrong without needing guidance from an omnipotent being.

 

I feel I have a problem with the statement that started this post.

To my understanding Mohammad never said he was the son of God “Allah” he as a prophet of God. A human entity that god spoke thru. I believe Mohammad was no different then the leader or if you want so say the prophets of the Old Testament. He delivered his people just as Moses and David did. And as for the murders, slaves and marriages. The Old Testament is full of it all with the seal of approval from God. If you read the books of Moses there was a lot of killing and land stealing in his name. As for the statement about homosexuality, I don’t think Jesus said anything about it. Just love everyone as you love yourself. If you believe the quote from bible about homosexuality then you should also believe you should be able to own slaves, not work or eat meat on Saturday and not be able to play baseball or football because they are made from pig skin. And let us not forget if your wife or daughter disobeys you its perfectly OK to take them out side the city limits and stone them to death. What ever you call God (Elohom, Yewah, Jehovah, The Almighty and even Allah) they are all base on the Jewish belief in a higher power.

People always have to start their own little group to make them feel special. Just as the Christian religions branched off to being Catholic, Lutheran, Protestant, Amish, Quaker, Mormon and the assorted types of Baptist. All these groups justified the killing of the others in the name of god. And Muslim of the Middle East which I truly believe are the one you have problems with have dealt with hundreds of years of Christians coming into their land and causing problems in the name of the lord. Just as the Christian god spoke to Moses and David tell them to kill in the name of god to protect his chosen people. So did god speak to Mohammad to protect and deliver his.

I think you should start hearing what Jesus said and meant instead of what people write and say he meant. You think Jesus would kill or ridicule a suicide bomber or embrace him and explain to him what he was doing is wrong.

 

I believe you illustrated John's point in your first sentence.

Mohammed is not the Son of God. Nor is he even an emmisary. Islam, on the other hand is from God. From the family of Abraham where the tree divided. It has been in conflict with itself ever since.

 

An Atheist actually. Feel better?

 

Just asking....who here actually read the bible and the koran?

 

Germany:

My brother has.

 

cool. Just wondering. Because I think in order to get a fair discussion you should've atleast read both books. Thats what I think......just my 0.02

 

Simply pointing out, Satanists are a Christian group as Satan is a Christian deity.

As for how I feel, I always feel Splendid.

 

I saw his leading post, just refrained from comment...

As for Satan (formerly known as Lucifer), even HE believes! He just refused to follow.

 

Satan is not a deity.

I'm sure he is elated to hear you have equated him with the Father.

 

I HAVE READ THE BIBLE AND THE KORAN,I HAVE ALSO TOOK IT A STEP FURTHER AND BEEN INVOLED WITH RELIGOUS STUDY GROUPS ABOUT UNDERSTANDING BOTH BOOKS AND THERE MEANING.YOU CAN READ A BOOK BUT THE TRUE MEANING IS UNDERSTANDING WHAT YOU HAVE READ.

 

Anyone who embraced a suicide bomber is asking for trouble, the best policy is to duck and run for cover.

 

Franc
The point I was trying to make was Mohammad never said he was the son of god. This post is trying to compare the two. If the post had made comparisons to leaders of the Old Testaments to Mohammad I would not have had a problem with it. But these people can't.

The group of Muslims that are doing these horrible things are no different then the action that were done here in the states by the misguided members of the KKK and other christian groups from around the world that still happening today. Both groups believed their doing God work and both could quoted scripture to justify it. I am not willing to damn a whole religion on the action of a few. Should we hate all Christianity because of the actions of Baptist members of the KKK. I think they should think about what Jesus said Ye with out sin cast the first stone. Until they can prove that no hurt is done in the world in the name of the Christian God. Don't worry about telling me and others to clean up my backyard until you clean up yours.

And to answer another post yes I have read both, plus the Kulpa Sutra, The Holy Kojiki, The Holy Kitab I Aqdas, Holy Tao Te Ching, as well as Bushido and the lost books of both Judaism and Christianity. If you call your self a true Christian you need to read more then the King James. There are more books of the Bible you need to read to truly understand the words of Jesus and his father. I have read all the above and learned from all of them on how to be a better person. I can't quote line and verse from any of them. I feel each one speaks to needs of the person reading them. And feel as I said before please understand the meaning not the words.

 

On a lighter note, a joke for the masses:

Moe: 'My wife got me to believe in religion.'

Joe: 'Really?'

Moe: 'Yeah. Until I married her I didn't believe in Hell...."

 

A fitting finale to this thread. Thanks JHM2K

 

It was the least I could do...