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Fuel Filter Issue or ?

Old Jun 30, 2018 | 08:45 AM
  #41 (permalink)  
onehundred80's Avatar
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From: Ontario
Default Re: Fuel Filter Issue or ?

Originally Posted by dinasrt
Regarding the manual stating that after 30 minutes it can bleed down to 36p.s.i., I believe this is a misnomer. It is my experience (and that of other x-fire owners)that the check valve can and does bleed down to a few p.s.i. after time. It only takes a pound or two of pressure to hold fuel in the lines from backing up. Even though my fuel rail gauge from Needswings shows zero after time, I know it has at least a couple pounds in there, as it always starts right up.
Even only one pound of pressure equals about 27 inches of water column;that is about the height difference between the pump and the injectors(give or take).
We are talking of gasoline and gasoline is lighter than water so the question is how many inches of gas would equal 1 Psi?
 
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Old Jun 30, 2018 | 10:02 AM
  #42 (permalink)  
ala_xfire's Avatar
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From: Lineville, AL
Default Re: Fuel Filter Issue or ?

Gasoline weighs about .744 what water does, so one pound of pressure = 33.75 inches of gasoline.
( IE we run with a column of gasoline almost 50 yards tall ! )
 
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Old Jun 30, 2018 | 01:01 PM
  #43 (permalink)  
dinasrt's Avatar
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From: Mendocino, CA
Default Re: Fuel Filter Issue or ?

Originally Posted by onehundred80
We are talking of gasoline and gasoline is lighter than water so the question is how many inches of gas would equal 1 Psi?
Thank you Dave, you helped make my point. The point was, that just 1 or 2 p.s.i. would be sufficient, so gasoline being lighter would take even less pressure. The other point is, that with the misnomer I previously mentioned, some folks could/would believe that if the pressure bleeds down below 36p.s.i. after 30 minutes that their fuel pump check valve was starting to fail. This doesn't appear to be the case; IMHO.
 
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Old Jul 2, 2018 | 08:52 AM
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HPMotors1's Avatar
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From: Greenville South Carolina
Default Re: Fuel Filter Issue or ?

Originally Posted by onehundred80
I cannot see it on the schematic but it shows up in the sketch. It did not show up on my iPad, that is why I missed it, it shows up on my desktop though.
I wonder if your electronic PC version of the manual is better documented than my old school paper version. They 3 volume set is thicker than a NYC phone book! I really haven't used them that much as my XFire has been surprisingly trouble free plus it has only 72 k miles - twice the mileage of your SRT6! That and my Base is missing quite a few things the Limited etc have so none of those features can break. In my mind that is an advantage for a "keeper" type of car. Only had it 12 years so far making it my "newest" vehicle at the opposite end of the spectrum from my 59 Bugeye which I've had 48 years. Come to think on it, the Bugeye has had not one problem with A/C, power windows, outside door handles, trunk lid, automatic turn signals etc. What a car eh?

How big is the file that you have on your ipad and did you buy it or is it free ware? Wonder why it is different than your PC version. There is a 2006 manual on this site. Is that the one you have? My manuals are for the 2005 model year.

HP
many old cars and one Crossfire
 
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Old Jul 2, 2018 | 09:34 AM
  #45 (permalink)  
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Default Re: Fuel Filter Issue or ?

Originally Posted by HPMotors1
I wonder if your electronic PC version of the manual is better documented than my old school paper version. They 3 volume set is thicker than a NYC phone book! I really haven't used them that much as my XFire has been surprisingly trouble free plus it has only 72 k miles - twice the mileage of your SRT6! That and my Base is missing quite a few things the Limited etc have so none of those features can break. In my mind that is an advantage for a "keeper" type of car. Only had it 12 years so far making it my "newest" vehicle at the opposite end of the spectrum from my 59 Bugeye which I've had 48 years. Come to think on it, the Bugeye has had not one problem with A/C, power windows, outside door handles, trunk lid, automatic turn signals etc. What a car eh?

How big is the file that you have on your ipad and did you buy it or is it free ware? Wonder why it is different than your PC version. There is a 2006 manual on this site. Is that the one you have? My manuals are for the 2005 model year.

HP
many old cars and one Crossfire
The electronic versions
on the Service Manual on this site are the 2004 and 2005. The 2005 has the SRT6 in it. Although it is not to thorough on the SRT6.
The Student Handbook is very helpful as it explains the systems quite well, the Service Msnuals assume you know all the technical theory.
Parts Manual exist here for all years as well as electronic parts files for the SLK320 And the SLK32.
All of these exist in the Crossfire Documentation thread.
 
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Old Jul 5, 2018 | 09:24 AM
  #46 (permalink)  
HPMotors1's Avatar
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From: Greenville South Carolina
Default Re: Fuel Filter Issue or ?

CONCLUSION AND WRAPUP

OK - for the one person that may be interested in this small but puzzling problem, here is the wrap up.

Back ground - 2005 Crossfire Base with 70,000 miles. Owned since 6,000 miles. Decided I had abused it long enough and decided to change fuel filter.

1) Installed new Mann filter - WK120 (Made in Germany). Used Oetiker clamps. Fit perfectly, but now the car cranked for an excessive period of time before firing. Ran fine once started.
2) Discovered Filter is more than just a filter. It is also the fuel pressure regulator and check valve assembly.
3) Bought and Installed OEM Mercedes filter - A 002 477 30 01. No change in operation, still excessive cranking. BTW, the Mann was only a few bucks cheaper than the MB and in hindsight the filter was not the problem so this is NOT a slam at Mann.
4) More research and trouble shooting. Oh yes, fuel pressure tester is vital! getting correct adapter caused a bit of a delay. Had I the adapter on day one, I likely would have gone directly to replacing pump.
5) Troubleshooting indicated probable issue was pump with its check valve. Bought and installed Bosch pump - 0 986 580 372 from German Auto Parts in Charlotte NC. $145 delivered. BTW, stock pump was a Pierburg stamped with the MB star and number 000-478-00-01.
6) Car now starts normally. Not at all sure why the fuel pump went bad simultaneously with changing filter. Best guess is somehow a bit of debris got dislodged and ended up in check valve. I just really hate a coincidence like this.

Probably 99% of filter changes won't have this problem, but one piece of advice is that this is more than a filter so the bargain basement things on eBay might not be such a bargain. Ditto on the pumps - I found some pumps on eBay for $19.99. Retail on the MB pump is over $800. Bosch retail is in the $250 range. $145 was best wholesale price I could find from a reputable vender I had dealt with in the past.


Thanks for all the helpful comments as I slowly made my way through this mess.
 

Last edited by HPMotors1; Jul 6, 2018 at 10:14 AM.
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Old Jul 5, 2018 | 01:36 PM
  #47 (permalink)  
JSK's Avatar
JSK
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From: Mesa Arizona
Default Re: Fuel Filter Issue or ?

Thanks for posting the final outcome.
 
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