Doc, if your like me you can remember using non detergent oil (early 60's Beetles) ....... and mixing your own for your 2 cycle.

Les

 

Getting forgetful these days Doc, they were SAE 20 and SAE 30, the W designation came with the multigrade designations if I recall correctly. Multigrades saved a lot of hassle, naturally the prices went up.

 

The dealership should put in the correct fluid, I would say you have the wrong fluid in the transmission possibly. I guess you are talking about tranny fluid. They put in what they had and that is not necessarily what should have been used. The engine oil could be wrong as well.
It pays to know exactly what they used, get it written down and not take their word that the correct fluids were used.

 

Ok, Completely hot engine, 190F on the Ultragauge (fan mod does not let it get any higher than that, about 1/2 needle width below halfway):

Idle: was 10-14 lbs on 0W40 now is 15-19 on 5W50

2050 RPM: was 32-34 lbs now is 41-44 lbs

Of course, as always - these are aftermarket gauge readings.
ON THAT NOTE: 180 - do you remember our discussion about my red roadster having 0-2 lbs of idle pressure? Well, as it turns out, it DID have a litte less pressure than this car, but this car showed 4-5 lbs........... UNTIL the gauge went bad. I ordered the SAME gauge and THIS car, like I said, now showed over 10 lbs. That gauge was defective - it read wrong below about 20 psi. And no, not hte sender, I have swapped senders and both the old and new show the same. It was the "head unit" that went bad and it was the "head unit" that was reading wrong.

It's a "Prosport" gauge. I still like them, cause they are cheap ($43 with sender and install kit) and are green like the XF's gauges.

 

Hi, gauges sometimes create more worry that their worth, you can turn an engine over a few times using a ratchet (with the heads off) and get plenty of pressure to circulate the oil and err make a mess, don't ask how I know this...lol, all to say even cold a few pounds of pressure and even low rpm's from the pump does move around 0-5 or 10w oil in an ample fashion, regardless of gauge reading.

regards

 

Lower pressure? Isn't that good. Means more oil is flowing to lub, clean and cool the parts. No?

 

I believe you're right. If the engine is not worn, lower pressure means better circulation. Higher pressure means oil that is too thick or a filter that is too restrictive.

 

Another way to gauge this in my view, excuse the pun....all things being equal you know you have chosen a good viscosity oil for your environment when oil pressure stabilizes quickly, start up to operating temp fluctuations are expected.

regads

 

The pressure may stabilize but the pressure could still be to high as the oil is too thick.
Using a 5W50 oil is not too smart as 50 oil flows like 50 oil at 212 deg F at 190 deg F it will flow like a 50+ oil grade.

The 5W means it flows less than a 0W oil at the same temperature, the 5 does not mean SAE 5, it flows much worse than a SAE 5 oil.

Stick with the 0W40 and you are better for it. 5W50 is bound to have higher pressure because it is thicker and there is less oil being moved because it is harder to push. But that has escaped some people.

A quote from the article listed below.
'The fact is that a 5w30 motor oil is thicker in cold temperatures than in warm temperatures. In fact, you could easily demonstrate this for yourself. Have you ever tried to pour oil out of the bottle in the winter – even a winter rated multi-viscosity oil? It pours more slowly, doesn’t it? That’s because the cold temperature “thickens” the oil.
However, a 5w30 motor oil will be thinner than a 10w30 motor oil when subjected to the same low temperature conditions – because the “W” number is lower. This is an indication of better cold weather performance. In other words, a 5w30 flows better in cold weather than a 10w30 motor oil will. Think of the “W” as a “winter” classification instead of a “weight” classification.'

 

Well, if 5w 50 or 15w 50 was so bad for our cars they wouldn't be on the recommended list. Granted that only one 15w 50 made the list but several 5w 50's did. I would never put 0w 30 in my car but I live in a hot climate. I might consider it if I lived in the Northwest Territories or Siberia. So don't be so harsh about 5w 50. It's an approved weight in Mobil 1. Stick with whats on the list and be happy. For most people 0w40, no doubt, is the best. For hot climates or racing conditions a 5w 50 is most likely more appropriate.

Les

 

While waiting for my rotors to be turned, I was bored so I'll chime in. Here's what I have both read and what I've heard first hand from Richard Winkles, the lead engine developer for the Viper since 92'. Basically, when referring to a good engine that's not worn out, low pressure can be bad during track events. Low pressure can mean the oil is too hot and has thinned to the point it isn't circulating well enough for the demands of the engine. Thinner oil exhibits lower pressure and sometimes means the engine isn't being protected as much because the oil is both thinner and moving less. Think of it this way, picture the oil pump moving a volume of oil, then picture it moving a volume of air. It won't move as much air because it's thinner and the oil pump can't maintain pressure. So the hotter your oil gets, the thinner it gets, the less protection it gives. That's why we put 15w-50 race fluid in our Vipers for track days. I was having issues where my RT/10 oil pressure would drop to 25PSI after a couple of laps and my check engine light would flash rapidly. Richard Winkles told my to put 15w-50 and my pressure never dropped below 40PSI after that.

By the way, Mobile 1 today is not what it used to be. It has less protection than in the past and because of this, all SRT vehicles will be switching over to Pennzoil Ultra 0w-40 starting with the 2013 Viper. Some of us thought it was a marketing stunt, but Richard Winkles claims the engineers found it protects better than the current Mobile 1.

New Pennzoil UltraTM 0W-40 Designed For All SRT Vehicles

P.S. O'Reilly has a sale on Mobile 1 0w-40 5.1 quart jugs. I just bought four for $27.45 each.

 

This is from the 2005 Repair Manual.

Use synthetic engine oils, approved to MB 229.3 or
MB 229.5, such as Mopar part number 05127394AA.
Synthetic SAE 0W-40 or SAE 5W-40 engine oils
approved to API SL and/or GF-3 may be substituted.

I cannot see any 5W-50 oils in the above that are acceptable substitutes. It could be said to be a bit ambiguous, but just because an oil is on the MB list does not make it approved. The above specifically says 0W-40 and 5W-40.

My 2004 NA Owners Manual says to use Mopar or Mobil SAE 0W40 synthetic oils or equivalent only.

The 2004/2005 Owners Manuals downloadable from this site are less specific.
Engine Oil Selection
Only use synthetic engine oils, approved to MB 229.3 or
MB 229.5, such as Mobil 1 SAE 0W-40. The FFS may not
alert for an oil change at the proper interval if an
unapproved engine oil is used; engine damage and
reduced engine life may result.

It goes on to say that 0W-40 is the preferred grade.

The 2004 Repair Manual says something entirely different and only muddies the water and can be ignored as it says nothing about 0W-40 oil at all and mentions a lower viscosity and not synthetic .
SAE VISCOSITY
An SAE viscosity grade is used to specify the viscosity of
engine oil. Use only engine oils with multiple viscosities such
as 5W-30 or 10W-30. These are specified with a dual SAE viscosity grade which indicates the cold-to-hot temperature viscosity range. Select an engine oil that is best suited to your particular temperature range and variation.

 

GULP !!!!!

$194 ( with shipping ) for 20 quart ( 5 gallon ) pail on Amazon. That's $9.70 a quart
or $77.60 for each oil change. A bit higher than M1, but who knows, maybe worth it.

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by onehundred80

This is from the 2005 Repair Manual.

Use synthetic engine oils, approved to MB 229.3 or
MB 229.5, such as Mopar part number 05127394AA.
Synthetic SAE 0W-40 or SAE 5W-40 engine oils
approved to API SL and/or GF-3 may be substituted.

I cannot see any 5W-50 oils in the above that are acceptable substitutes. It could be said to be a bit ambiguous, but just because an oil is on the MB list does not make it approved. The above specifically says 0W-40 and 5W-40.

My 2004 NA Owners Manual says to use Mopar or Mobil SAE 0W40 synthetic oils or equivalent only.

The 2004/2005 Owners Manuals downloadable from this site are less specific.
Engine Oil Selection
Only use synthetic engine oils, approved to MB 229.3 or
MB 229.5, such as Mobil 1 SAE 0W-40. The FFS may not
alert for an oil change at the proper interval if an
unapproved engine oil is used; engine damage and
reduced engine life may result.

It goes on to say that 0W-40 is the preferred grade.

The 2004 Repair Manual says something entirely different and only muddies the water and can be ignored as it says nothing about 0W-40 oil at all and mentions a lower viscosity and not synthetic .
SAE VISCOSITY
An SAE viscosity grade is used to specify the viscosity of
engine oil. Use only engine oils with multiple viscosities such
as 5W-30 or 10W-30. These are specified with a dual SAE viscosity grade which indicates the cold-to-hot temperature viscosity range. Select an engine oil that is best suited to your particular temperature range and variation.

That's because up until 2003, Chrysler was putting 5w-30 and 10w-30 in SRT vehicles, Vipers included. But SRT found that 0w-40 Mobile 1 provided better protection being that it was a more modern oil and had more wear protection properties. It's possible that the 2004 manual wasn't updated in time for the change.

 

I'm loving my AMSOIL 5W-40 since I am a preferred customer and my neighbor is a dealer who stocks up on it. He makes his once a month pickup at the Orlando warehouse and I buy it at cost. I change it out every 5000 miles.

 

Are you aware that Mobil 1 0w 40 formulation has changed? All viscosities have changed. Yep, all oils undergo changes over the years which is why recommended oils change. I'll use ANY oils on the current MB recommended list with confidence. That includes several brands of 5w 50. Yeah, I have the label to use only Movil 1 0w-40 under the hood. Unfortunately, I can't find 0w40 with a 2006 production date. This is a useless discussion IMO. From all indications, 0w-40 is one of Mobils 1 best oils. But that doesn't mean that for hot climate, high mileage or racing conditions it's the only oil to use. If you actually look at the list of approved oils they range from 0w30 to 15w-50. Yes, I know Chrysler doesn't have a list like MB does. So we need to scour the internet for oil produced in 2005 to be in true compliance.

Les

 

No matter what viscosity synthetic we buy the shearing power of our engines causes the molecule chain to break apart and it doesn't take very long. The world is a changing place, oil and fuel is also changing, in my neck of the woods were down to having only Shell selling gas without ethanol and only Petro-Can selling octane higher than 91 . Ethanol is hard on rubber parts for my other machines...fuel affects oil directly so choosing the right one makes a diff... I don't drive my Crossfire during winter or after the first salting so it sits alot so an oil change can be longer. Its hard to find even 0-40 Mobil , I found a few litres so it will be a 5-40 Syntec and mOBIL mix(MB approuved) with Lucas synthetic stabilzer(pure synthetic 1 litre thrown in to keep the enigne lifters happy when it sits).

 

Your neck of the woods?

 

I'd hazard the guess he is from the great nation of Canada, no bias here.

 

That is correct, ..perhaps a little intro is in order, married male english/french canadian with 2 fine adult son/daughter.
education... auto mechanic, later in life recycled myself went to University studied economics, gov't job since 28yrs in competition law... retiring soon...
hobby repairing and riding motorcycles last 35yrs, losing my passion for bikes so last few years been returning to sporty cars ;

having fun with the CF...

regards
Bern