Some background first for the non followers of the trials of Velociabstract. IAT's run hot. Car runs hot. See Les scratch head. See Les rethink all he's done. See Les chase his tail. See Les with 3 heat exchangers. See Les with new thermal coated intercooler. See Les with a new intercooler pump. See Les pump water out of his separated intercooler circuit on track. See Les going in circles. Les is tired. Les is frustrated. OK people. Now that we're up to date here's my sacrilege. I reconnected the cooling and intercooler systems. Yep, did it. My current setup has an E55AMG heat exchanger, brand new Bosch 010 intercooler pump wired to be always on. I removed the supercooler to lower my engine water temperatures (cooler air to the radiator) and ever since that day I overheat the intercooler water on track. (ECT's dropped a few degrees) Before reinstalling the supercooler I've been doing some experiments. I can tell you that with the stock heat exchanger, E55 heat exchanger and supercooler the IAT's end up within 5º of one another on the street with a split system. I can tell you the system needs to be pressurized if your going to be WOT for 8 minutes and up. Even if your sensor is saying 180º you have hot spots over boiling temperature. If you run a remote reservoir it needs to be pressurized or your going to squirt water out the top. The supercooler has a pressure cap so in my mind it's pressurized, to be clear about that. My experience with all the combinations up to now is that the difference between the huge capacity heat exchangers and stock is the time it take to reach and hold a temperature. The difference between a new pump and old pump is the time it takes to reach and hold a temperature. That temperature, with all other conditions being the same is identical. It just takes longer to reach it. Next step, depending on what I learn in the next few weeks, will be to re install the super cooler with a connected system. Then perhaps split it again. Then perhaps fab up a remote reservoir that's pressurized a la Brian Brave for instance. (Why o why didn't I do that in the first place) Saludos Brian! Track day is Sunday. I sure want to run all three 20 minutes sessions without having to slow down because of IAT's or EGT's. Let's see what happens now that the systems are returned to SRT's engineers design.

Les

 

If all your cooling improvement have resulted in an increase in time to reach terminal temp you need to improve air flow. Can you measure air speed through the radiator and compare it to ground speed.

I know your activities are unique but are you going where none have gone before. Are your activities the cause or would any CF experience the same issure under your environment.

 

I didn't data log when my car was stock or when I just had a CAI and pulley. I started right before I got my first tune. I wasn't aware of heat issues until after my first tune. I concur that forcing more air through the radiators instead of around them would help. I spent a whole day building templates and fabricating shrouding to force more air through the radiator but I failed. I also believe part of the problem is how to exhaust the air. If I find a cheap used hood I'll put some vents in it.

Les

 

Damn Les I'm just having a hard time heating up my summer compound tires so far this year. Hopefully that will change soon.

 

Thanks for all your history in one summary. You have done an excellent job identifying and working out problems. I know you run your car like it should be ran and appreciate all of your feedback and insight.

 

I'm confirming for myself what others before me have learned that seems hard to accept. It's really difficult to find large improvements. A degree here and there is all that comes easily.

Les

 

Interesting observations, and I would agree with your conclusions.

A degree here, and a degree there, but it's delaying the inevitable. That's honestly a perfect sentence to sum this car up. The SRT-6 is a great tool to surprise cars with a far superior pedigree in small spurts, but eventually, the Crossfire's weaknesses manifest themselves and we're reminded it's a grand-touring coupe on steroids, not a proper race car built for hours of track use.

While it's true that you can race with it (and do well), it's not purpose-designed for such. As a result, all of our mods simply serve to make the best of a handicapped platform.

 

You are already married to this car, bite the bullet and get a custom made larger radiator.

Would you be interested in trying the fan controller and 160F themostat I have? You can borrow them to test if you want. Im wondering if your fan is actually running when the car is at speed.

 

After about 50mph I would think the fan is blocking airflow. If there is not enough airflow a larger radiator will just delay the problme.

What is your speed range?

 

Speed range varies from track to track. One track is 30 to 140 mph. Another is 35 to 120 mph. I'll play with ducting once more and see what I can do. I have a track day on Sunday the 7th. I'll try to remember to pull the fan one of the heats to see if it makes any difference.

Les

 

les grip and i ran about the same engine setups. i ran a s/c and then passed it to grip. oddly he ran higher temps than i did. whats the difference? look at the slk32 grill and yours. we had huge open space that you dont. look at the slk32 lower bumper and yours. more open space. fwiw thats the difference. airflow. building a tank will help only if you can provide enough ice to last the entire run. if not then as soon as the ice melts the temps will become ambient or more. you can have a 10 gal. tank it wont matter. you could rig a tank loaded with alcohol and a switch to spray the h/e when temps start to rise but it wont last for long.
sadly you live in a hot climate and race for longer than most any other kind of race. its a double dagger to your cooling system

fwiw i also ran higher ect temps. lowered them with a 180 tstat and 180 fan mod. it helped until aug and then eng temps were 200* on a consistent basis

 

I went out and looked under the hood of my NA. Getting air in and out of that radiator was not high on the engineers priority list.

 

Maybe not, but mine maintains 185 F on the road, it never goes over 200 F even in traffic with A/C on ....

 

^ neither of you have a s/c generating huge amounts of heat either. major difference

 

Agreed. I was just responding to the mention of the NA temps ....

 

Les, along w/ Tuna's over sized race radiator idea, I like your idea of pursuing an additional vented race hood, (and I know it's certainly not an easy mod to make look good,as well as being practical) but you could use a hood like Woody's. His inverted front sections on each side, pulls/slipstreams the hot air right out at speed; and vents even standing still. Maybe additional louvers all the way up the hood wherever you can put them. Swiss cheese the thing,lol. Too bad you can't just run w/o a hood all together.

 

My radiator is to draw out the heat and promote more mass thru the radiator. It seems good but I dont have the real estate or tracks to truly load it like you do. I do know that it is rain safe on the streets, no issues yet or when washing. The gallery has info on the 101 degree day I came back from carlisle last summer and used a temp gun to see the heat being pushed out at idle, I did probes while driving and got favorable results results also. Couple of years now and no issues, as seen at the Pa. Meet several years. Enjoy

https://www.crossfireforum.org/forum...29-albums.html

https://www.crossfireforum.org/forum...bum_form=63302

https://www.crossfireforum.org/forum...udy-63203.html


If interested I can discuss my design, though the gallery is almost self explanitory. Woody And yes 180 I am lysdexic.

 

Woody, you've got to know I follow everything you do and always have. All I need is a hood to chop up. I really like the simplicity of yours and the openings are in the right place. I'll start searching the local used car parts rip off artists and see what turns up.

Les

 

I have always admired this hood. Now if THIS had been done in carbon fiber...

 

This is the stock steel hood and no real cost, anyway I could make a paper template of the cut lines if needed, you pay the shipping of the USPS box, probably 5-8 dollars. Just let me know. Woody