Just remembered I've replaced fuel pump and filter. All vacuum line and PVC hoses.Ran out of ideas

 

Same here, bosch pump and filter and injectors. new intake gaskets, pcv hoses, tb o-ring, and both seals on the MAF elbow. The only thing I didn't replace was the gaskets for the secondary air injectors, but they seemed ok if I remember correctly.

 

I don't think the milage has anything to do with it. You sad yours has 245,000 mine has 123,000 but I bought it at 83,000 it was doing then.

 

Please read post #17.

 

I've tried several times. Can't find any leaks.

 

In my first attempt at a throttle upgrade I got a bad throttle body which exhibited the problems you are both having. I got another throttle body and that corrected the problem. Throttle bodies do go bad.
Here is the throttle reset procedure. It won't hurt to give it a try:

Keep the key in for the entire process.

1) Turn the key to the on position, the position just before the starter turns over.

2) Press the gas pedal firmly to the floor with the key in the "on" position.

3) Hold the pedal to the floor for five seconds, then turn the key back to the "off" position (don't remove the key), then release the gas pedal.

4) Wait 2 mins. for a full reset

Summary: Key on, pedal down 5 sec, key off, pedal up, wait 2 minutes.


If this doesn't work, disconnect your neg. battery cable for 20 minutes.
This will re-set the parameters in the drive-by-wire

 

Ok, I ordered a new O ring for the throttle body. When I removed the throttle body, the old O ring was still seated nicely in its groove, but it did seem a little thinner than the one I replaced it with. I switched back to the original v6 throttle body, and went back to the v6 MAF housing as well. I also added an auxiliary ground cable from the trans bell housing to the battery. I performed the throttle reset procedure and cleared the codes. After 1 quick test drive all seems ok. But it will have to drive fine for at least a week before I even begin to think the problem is solved.... I will update as time goes on.

 

Went for a nice long drive yesterday evening, the dreaded check engine light returned.... still claims to be rich in 1 bank and lean on the other. Also, sprayed ether around the engine bay Saturday prior to swapping the TB and MAF out and had no noticeable changes in operation when doing that, so I can only assume there are no vacuum leaks.

 

If there is no more rough running, then you are closer to a solution to the issue. Sometimes, multiple things cause issues that distract. Finding them involves solving one thing at a time. Make sure the rough running is solved then tackle the remaining one step at a time. Finally, do not discard the fact that your issue may still be related to things you put back into the car (that amplified the initial upgrades resulting in the mess you have). If there is a bad component you still have then find it before you move on to another possibility. Good luck!


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I had a little nugget of stumbling this morning on the drive in to work.

In my endless pondering, a question popped in my mind... I have some oil leakage due to the oil level sensor not sealing completely. Is it possible that negative crankcase pressure is pulling in unmetered outside air and pulled in the intake via the pcv system causing the lean codes and intermittent rough running?

 

Good question, I guess it might be possible. To see if that is a possibility find all the hoses for the PCV system that returns to the intake and plug both sides of the hose or hoses you find (I believe there is only one that goes into the elbow before the throttle body or the TB itself?). Maybe other members know if this is a certainty? Make sure you plug both sides (the hose end and the elbow end) of any/each hose you open up. Good luck!


.

 

Update: I was still unable to source the issue, so I finally took it to my repair shop Certified Auto in Fort Myers. They didn't get the 2 codes I was getting, P2096 and P2099, but instead got 4 Oxygen sensor codes. I told them I never cleared the codes since I last read them and to re-read the codes with my Mac Tools tool which I keep in the car. They did get those again, but said they are generic codes. They did a smoke test after that and found that thete is a leak where the vacuum tube goes from the brake booster to the intake. It doesn't appear that this is a serviceable part, so they recommend replacing the intake. Stealership price for an intake is $2300.... lol. They already knew my answer to that. I'm picking it up tomorrow and it'll get a bead of black RTV. Hopefully this will be problem solved. I'll report my findings.

 

The vacuum line from the intake to the brake buster is serviceable. That fitting on the intake is a quick connect and you can remove the vacuum line by first unscrewing the black outer ring then you will see a colored ring that is pushed forward against the intake and the vacuum tube is then wiggled loose. It is not the easiest thing to do, but that vacuum line will come out. BEFORE YOU SLATHER SILICONE AROUND THAT FITTING YOU SHOULD PULL THE VACUUM LINE OUT, INSPECT THE END PIECE AND THEN REINSERT. I hate to see you gunk something up for the next guy, if it can be avoided. The vacuum line at the brake booster is just pressed into a rubber grommet. It too is not easy to remove, but with some wiggling and a little WD40 will come out.

 

Hi All,
In case the brake boost vacuum hose isn't the issue, you might look at the fuel injector o-rings. I had a chevy V6 with only 113,000 miles on it that had similar symptoms (lean, o2 sensors). I had just replaced the head gaskets (overheating problem), but decided not to replace the fuel injector o-rings since the car was low mileage. Figured it was a vacuum leak, but it only has two vacuum hoses so it was easy to rule them out. After racking my brains, I figured what did I have to lose, so I replaced the fuel injector o-rings, and the problem was solved. Cars been running like a top for the last 4 years.
-Jerry

 

I checked connections myself and they looked fine. A bead of sealant on the booster hose and the fitting left overnight to seal produced zero changes.
As for the fuel injector o-rings, they and the injectors are all brand new.

I am going to pull another intake on friday since the junk yard will have a black friday sale.

I'm at a loss and grasping at straws now.

 

When you get that intake manifold from the junkyard take a good look inside. You should be able to move the flap valves ( don't know their correct name, but they open and close which gives you the long or short runners for the air routing to the cylinders) from the front of the manifold where the solenoid attaches. Be sure that it flips back and forth smoothly opening and closing those door type valves. You may even want to spray a bunch of degreaser into the manifold and finish up with brake cleaner to help clean the interior of the manifold. It is actually two pieces that can come apart and give you access to the interior, but you may not want to go that far. Inspect your current manifold when you have it off and compare it to the junkyard as to cleanliness and operation. An endoscope would be helpful here. You'll need new gaskets.

 

I cleaned my intake when I had it off for paint and aside from lots of buildup in it from the pcv system the flaps or butterfly vlaves as i called them seemed free and operational. You can feel them open up around 3000 or 3500 rpm when driving, so it seems they still are ok. New gaskets were used when reinstalling it. I will get new ones again for the new one and might lay a thin bead of sealant on both sides of it this time also as a precaution.

 

Monitor your live readings of the MAP sensor and the engine temperature sensor; They are used by the PCM to adjust fuel trim.They might be going bad. Also check the vapor purge valve that it maintains a vacuum. Could be that is a problem source.
I know you changed fuel pump and filter, but some of the auto part stores sell incorrect filters. The Crossfire has a pressure regulator in the filter so be certain you have a correct filter and pump. Otherwise most roads lead back to oxygen sensors or a corroded, bad connection somewhere.

 

I can look at those 2 parameters while driving, but I don't know what to look for on the MAP reading to know it it is abnormal.
The filter/regulator should be correct they were both Bosch and matched the parts removed.... but if there was a fuel pressure problem I would assume I would have more issues with WOT than idle and part throttle.
As for the coolant sensor, where is it located, I can inspect it and the connection on it as I haven't looked at it yet.

 

The coolant temp sensor is on the front of the engine just to the left of the thermostat housing and above the idle pulley. The MAP sensor is just to the left of the coolant sensor. When you turn the ignition on engine not running the MAP sensor should give you atmospheric pressure 14.7 PSI ( 29.9 inHG). And it should be steady, When you start the engine the MAP should follow vacuum steady and not be fluctuating ( give or take about 1 inHG) so at idle the MAP will be about 10 inHG ( 29.9 - vacuum about 20 inHG at idle) as speed increases the vacuum decrease and the MAP should increase steadily not be jumping all over the place. Same with your MAF readings. AS MAF increases MAP decreases.
Water coolant temperature should act normally, increasing as from cold to warm then steady at the upper limit as your care warms. If you see fluctuations that don't make sense replace the sensor.